City Council · afternoon

6:07Good afternoon.

6:08I am calling back to order this meeting of the Portland City Council.

6:12It is 2 o'clock on Thursday, June 25th.

6:15Rebecca, can we please call the roll?

6:19Good afternoon.

6:20Kanal?

6:20Here.

6:21Pirtle-Guiney?

6:22Here.

6:23Ryan?

6:24Here.

6:24Koyama Lane?

6:28I'm sorry, was that Councilor Koyama Lane online?

6:31No.

6:32No, thank you.

6:33Uh, Morillo?

6:34Here.

6:35Novick?

6:36Here.

6:38Clark?

6:39Here.

6:40Green?

6:40Here.

6:41Zimmerman?

6:43Avalos?

6:44Present virtually.

6:46Smith?

6:47Here.

6:48Dunphy?

6:49Here.

6:50And can we please read the rules of decorum for the chamber?

6:55Good afternoon.

6:56Welcome to the Portland City Council.

6:58To testify before council in person or virtually, you must sign up in advance on the council agenda at www.portland.gov/council/agenda.

7:06Information on engaging with council can be found on the council clerk's webpage.

7:09Individuals may testify for 3 minutes unless the presiding officer states otherwise.

7:13Your microphone will be muted when your time is over.

7:16The presiding officer preserves order.

7:18Disruptive conduct such as shouting, refusing to Your testimony when your time is up or interrupting others' testimony or council deliberations will not be allowed.

7:26If you cause a disruption, a warning will be given.

7:28Further disruption will result in ejection from the meeting.

7:31Anyone who fails to leave once ejected is subject to arrest for trespass.

7:34Additionally, council may take a short recess and reconvene virtually.

7:37Your testimony should address the matter being considered.

7:39When testifying, state your name for the record.

7:41Your address is not necessary.

7:42If you are a lobbyist, identify your organization you represent.

7:45Virtual testifiers should unmute themselves when the council clerk calls your name.

7:48Thank you, Council Clerk Rebecca Dobert.

7:49Thank you very much.

7:51So colleagues, as we all know, yesterday we barely got through about half of the appellants' signed-up testimony.

7:57We did not get to the other presentations or anything else.

8:04So I will just— this is a note for folks watching at home and for in the audience.

8:08If you are here in order to see the TNC, Driver Resource Center, that item will certainly not be heard today.

8:16We have too many things on the agenda.

8:17And additionally, if you are here for the recap package, Package 11 item.

8:23There is a small possibility we will get to it towards the end, but almost certainly we're not going to be doing that today.

8:28So additionally, at the end of our meeting yesterday, we discussed suspending the rules to address a number of very quick must-do pieces of legislation, plus the second reading from Councilor Novick.

8:40With consent from this body, I'd like to move that— I'd like unanimous consent to have— move items 7 through 10 to the front of our agenda.

8:48So moved.

8:48Second.

8:49At which point we would then return to the Lloyd Center land use appeal item number 5.

8:54We would hopefully open recap 11 after concluding testimony, though, as I said, there are still nearly 100 people who are officially signed up to testify.

9:03I don't know that they're all here, but they may be online.

9:05But regardless— Point of information.

9:08Yes.

9:08Council President, item 7 is recap, and you suggested that we move that to the top of the agenda.

9:14Well, that's because I'm— oh, I have item 7 as the use.

9:17Sewer and stormwater.

9:18Because you didn't have the— remember, the thing got added.

9:20Oh, right, right.

9:21So it's 8 through 11.

9:23Thank you.

9:23I apologize, I'm not good with numbers.

9:26Okay, so you're— you are asking us to approve moving agenda items 8 through 11?

9:31Yes.

9:32Ahead of agenda items 6 and 7?

9:34Thank you.

9:34Yes.

9:35Thank you, Council President.

9:36I appreciate your attention to detail.

9:37Do we need a motion for that?

9:40Um, okay.

9:41I did— no, I don't, I don't.

9:42Just to see if there is any objection.

9:44With no objection, seeing none, the agenda is reordered.

9:48And can we please call item 8?

9:53Item 8, revise sewer and stormwater rates, charges, and fees for FY 2026-27, document number 2026-218.

10:02Thank you very much.

10:04Colleagues, this item did not go through a committee because this is a technical emergency fix from the Water Bureau.

10:11I believe Water Bureau staff are here to present.

10:13Oh, here we are.

10:13One Water Director Ting Lu is here to give us a A brief or quick presentation and some technical clarifying questions about what this is.

10:23So Director, take it away.

10:25Thank you so much, Council President and Council Members.

10:28For the record, my name's Ting Lu, Public Utilities Director.

10:32This item is for BES rate fees revision.

10:36With that, I would like to ask Council Clerk, please pull up the short presentation.

10:51So next slide, please.

10:53Thank you.

10:55So just for background, the BES and water rate ordinances were approved by Council on 27th of May last month.

11:03It was recently brought to our attention that Exhibit A to the sewer rate ordinance, which documents all rates, fees, and charges, had an error.

11:14In Exhibit A, Section F, the sanitary and stormwater SDS rates didn't get updated to the 9% increase as what was presented to the council on May 14th.

11:26So you can see on the table that we have the track changes here.

11:30Essentially, we updated number for the 9% increase here.

11:35With that opportunity, we also made a couple other formatting changes.

11:40Next slide, please.

11:41Thank you.

11:43So the Section G didn't incorporate the correct reference to class average and the minimum use per element rule, ENB 4.09.

11:53So I'm showing here as a table to see the track changes to better align with the reference and classes here.

12:00The next slide shows the last formatting change we made.

12:05Essentially, we removed the dollar sign to better represent how we are measuring the square foot of the stormwater fee charges and also the column headings to better align with what is actually used for basis for calculation versus actually a unit cost.

12:22So just using the opportunity to making sure things are clear and transparent.

12:27So thank you so much for the time here.

12:30Thank you, colleagues.

12:31Are there any technical or clarifying questions?

12:34Councilor Kanal?

12:35Yeah, if in the event that we pass it, can we also post the track changes version?

12:40Online just for reference.

12:42Of course.

12:43Yeah, yeah, we can follow up on that.

12:45Excellent.

12:46Thanks.

12:46Thank you, Councilor Kanal.

12:49Uh, Rebecca, is there anyone signed up for public testimony on this?

12:55There's one person signed up, Anne Casper.

13:13Anne Casper.

13:21That concludes testimony.

13:22Okay, thank you very much.

13:23Sorry, Anne.

13:24Thanks for signing up.

13:25Hopefully if you are listening and are able to submit written testimony, we'd be happy to take it.

13:31Colleagues, is there any further discussion?

13:33On this item.

13:36Councilor Pirtle-Guiney.

13:38I just want to make sure we are super clear.

13:42The written documents with the original information said that there was a 9% increase.

13:48The numbers just didn't match, and we are now updating the numbers to align with the written documents.

13:54This is not any sort of additional increase beyond what we've already discussed and debated.

14:00Can we get that just fully confirmed so that as we're having conversations with Portlanders, it's clear that this is what has already been discussed?

14:10Correct.

14:11This was presented at the council on May 14th at the work session, but unfortunately the ordinance didn't update it to reflect the 9% change.

14:21Okay, thank you.

14:23Thank you very much.

14:23Councilor Pirtle-Guiney.

14:25Seeing no one else in the queue, Rebecca, this is an emergency ordinance, colleagues.

14:30It requires 9 votes to pass.

14:31Can we please call the roll?

14:35We have 2 online for those.

14:40Calling the vote for document number 2026-218.

14:46Kanal?

14:46Aye.

14:48Pirtle-Guiney?

14:49Aye.

14:49Ryan?

14:52Stepped away.

14:53Uh, Koyama Lane is absent.

14:57Murillo?

14:59Aye.

15:00Novick?

15:01Aye.

15:02Clark?

15:03Aye.

15:03Green?

15:04Aye.

15:06Zimmerman absent.

15:07Avalos?

15:09Aye.

15:10Smith?

15:11Aye.

15:12Dunphy?

15:12Aye.

15:14And the ordinance passes with 9 aye and 3 absent votes.

15:17Thank you very much.

15:18Could we please move to item 9?

15:22Item 9, authorize a cable franchise fund for the Bureau of Planning and Sustainability to support the collection of public education and government revenues and manage cable franchise work related to intergovernmental agreements with jurisdictions, document number 2026-175.

15:37Colleagues, this is the second reading of a non-emergency ordinance.

15:40Is there any further discussion?

15:45Seeing none, Rebecca, can we please call the roll?

15:48Kanal?

15:48Aye.

15:50Pirtle-Guiney?

15:50Aye.

15:52Ryan?

15:52Absent.

15:53Koyama Lane?

15:55Absent.

15:55Murillo?

15:59Aye.

16:00Novick?

16:01Aye.

16:01Clark?

16:02Aye.

16:03Green?

16:04Aye.

16:07Zimmerman is absent.

16:10Avalos?

16:11Aye.

16:11Smith?

16:12Aye.

16:13Dunphy?

16:14Uh, Councilor Ryan has returned.

16:16Aye.

16:17Councilor Ryan is an aye.

16:18And I'm an aye as well.

16:20And Dunphy is an aye.

16:22The ordinance passes with 10 aye, 2 absent.

16:25Thank you very much.

16:26Can we please move to item 10?

16:32Item 10, amend city code to reflect the dissolution of Mount Hood Cable Regulatory Commission, amend code chapters 3.33 and 3.115, document number 2026-176.

16:45Colleagues, this is also the second reading of a non-emergency ordinance.

16:48Is there further discussion?

16:53Seeing none, could we please call the roll?

16:54Kanal?

16:57Aye.

16:59Aye.

16:59Aye.

17:00Aye.

17:01Aye.

17:07Novick?

17:08Aye.

17:09Clark?

17:09Aye.

17:10Green?

17:11Aye.

17:13Zimmerman absent.

17:14Avalos?

17:15Aye.

17:16Smith?

17:16Aye.

17:17Dunphy?

17:18Aye.

17:19The ordinance passes with 10 aye, 2 absent.

17:25Thank you very much.

17:26And could we please read item 11?

17:30Item 11, amend city code to transfer oversight of portable sign placement in the right-of-way and remove registration requirements.

17:38Amend Code Title 32 and add Code Chapter 17.110, document number 2026-174.

17:45This is the second reading of a non-emergency ordinance.

17:47Council colleagues, some discussion?

17:49Councilor Kanal.

17:51Yeah, thank you.

17:51I, I, uh, just wanted to thank Councilor Novick for bringing this forward.

17:54I think it's good to keep looking for little things we can do that are very easy to make owning a business in Portland a little less of a headache and a tad less expensive.

18:04Thanks.

18:05Thank you, Councilor Knoll.

18:06Councilor Novick.

18:07Thank you, Councilor Knoll.

18:08Thank you, Mr. President.

18:09I just wanted to say that in addition to the requirement for a permit for a sandwich board being silly, I would also argue that it's a form of discrimination against particularly well-informed and conscientious people because the vast majority of people either aren't aware there's a permit requirement or say, you got to be kidding me, and don't follow it.

18:27But there are these earnest folks that it's like, okay, there's a requirement.

18:30I'm going to send in my $100.

18:32So it's that subgroup of people that would be particularly grateful, I think.

18:38Thank you, Councilor Novick.

18:39Councilor Green.

18:42Thank you.

18:42Thank you, Councilor Novick, once again.

18:43Today we're legalizing sandwich boards.

18:46Tomorrow we're legalizing hot dog carts that will also sell vegan hot dogs.

18:50Thanks.

18:52Thank you.

18:52Seeing no one else in the queue, Rebecca, can we please call the roll?

18:57Calling roll on document 2026-174.

19:00Kanal.

19:01Aye.

19:01Aye.

19:02Pirtle-Guiney?

19:02Aye.

19:03Ryan?

19:04Aye.

19:05Koyama Lane?

19:06Absent.

19:06Murillo?

19:07An easy yes.

19:09Novick?

19:10Aye.

19:11Clark?

19:12Aye.

19:12Green?

19:13Aye.

19:14Zimmerman, absent.

19:15Avalos?

19:15Y'all are making me hungry.

19:17Aye.

19:18Smith?

19:19Aye.

19:20Dunphy?

19:21Aye.

19:21The ordinance passes with 10 aye, 2 absent.

19:23Okay, thank you everybody in this room for your patience as we went around and sounded like pirates.

19:29Um, can we move back to item 5, please?

19:33It's renumbered item 6.

19:34It's now item number 6.

19:35I'm sorry.

19:36On today's agenda, consider appeals of the Design Commission's approval of a voluntary Central City Master Plan review and adjustment review for the Lloyd Center Central City Master Plan, Land Use 2025-091308 CCMS AD, document number 2026-217.

19:54Okay, first, colleagues, the City Attorney will make some announcements about today's hearing.

19:58So Lauren, am I right?

20:00Am I turning to you?

20:01I can restate the announcements from yesterday, but it's a continuation, so I don't need to make them all.

20:06Although I would ask Council, given that we did have a continuation, if anyone had any ex parte communication between or site visits between yesterday and today to please disclose those.

20:19Not seeing anybody jumping in the queue.

20:21Nobody went and visited Lloyd Center after the day yesterday?

20:23Okay.

20:26So we left off yesterday in the middle of testimony supporting the appellants.

20:30We're going to pick that up, but just so folks in the room know what's going to go on, we're going to finish the testimony for the appellants and supporters of the appellants.

20:39We'll then have a presentation from the applicant for 30 minutes.

20:42We'll then hear from supporters for the applicant at 90 seconds each, and finally a rebuttal from the— by the appellants together for 5 minutes total.

20:51So can we please get back into our public testimony?

21:01Sorry, minor correction.

21:02For the appellants, it's 5 minutes per appellant.

21:05So it's a total of 10 minutes.

21:07Perfect.

21:07Thank you.

21:07Thank you.

21:08And I'll begin calling the remainder of the appellant testifiers.

21:12Just a quick reminder, I'll call you in groups of 5.

21:16You'll have 90 seconds.

21:17There'll be a reminder chime when you have 30 seconds remaining and one when your time is up.

21:23The first 5 are Julie Weber, Stephanie Yarnovich, Chris Yarnovich, Jennifer Meyer, Adeline Schaefer.

21:39I suspect we will have some drop-off.

21:42I'll move on.

21:43To Sarah Miller, Cole Doig, James Haskell, Conrad Lasota.

21:55Come on down, folks.

21:57Whoever arrives at the table, you're welcome to go first.

21:58Please introduce yourself for the record.

22:00You're welcome to share your pronouns, and you have 90 seconds.

22:03I'm Sarah Miller.

22:04My parents took me to Lloyd Center as a little girl.

22:07I loved it.

22:08When they decided to enclose the mall, I was sad to lose the open air, but soon came to love the new version and how crucial to now have a climate refuge.

22:17Then one day I was making precious memories with my kids, watching the ice skaters and each getting something at the t-shirt shop together.

22:24Later on, my teenagers had a safe place to go meet up with their friends, a welcoming place for all people.

22:31I hope to show my grandkids what that feels like someday.

22:34Shared generational experiences.

22:36Change can happen and has happened.

22:39Development and housing alongside preservation of the already existing community hub and tourist attraction, a music venue is being constructed on the west end and the east end can be developed to let 13th to 14th Street come through.

22:54New ownership for the rest.

22:56Let us honor our past by moving it forward.

22:59But neither an empty lot nor the speculative plans for development follow the district approval criteria that our city has set.

23:06There are categories that are not met in the City Center Master Plan, such as Urban Form 5.LD-1, which says to encourage dense development in Central Lloyd while preserving neighborhood character, nor Community 2.LD-3, which says to create public spaces, art, and activities that build community identity.

23:24And there's others I would list if I had time.

23:26These criteria are already true in the current infrastructure, which can be built upon, as in Guideline Existing Buildings A6 that says to reuse and restore existing buildings when feasible.

23:37It's no doubt feasible.

23:38Thank you for your service and deep consideration.

23:41Thank you very much.

23:45Whoever wants to go.

23:47All right.

23:48Hello, City Council.

23:49My name is Cole, and I'm here today to demand reevaluation of the conditions of the currently appealed master plan to demolish the Lloyd Center.

23:58Due to time restrictions, my testimony is framed primarily around highlighting how the master plan comes at odds with Policy 6 LD 1.

24:07Sustainability used to be a main priority of the City of Portland, yet the demolition alone will create an estimated 123 to 300 million pounds of waste.

24:18The construction industry is responsible for 37% of all carbon emissions worldwide.

24:25Will a couple bike lanes offset this waste or just provide optics?

24:29If demolition is at the core of the plan, any pledges to meet current energy efficiency standards?

24:36In 2026, I find it hard to believe that demolish, rebuild, demolish, rebuild is a sustainable path forward for Portland.

24:40Do we want to be known as a city that prioritizes new construction over preservation of historic buildings, one that happened to be refurbished within the last decade to meet current energy efficiency standards?

24:56In 2026, I find it hard to believe that demolish, rebuild, demolish, rebuild is a sustainable path forward for Portland.

25:01Is an innovative approach to sustainability, energy efficiency, water conservation, water reduction, and climate adaptation.

25:10How in this case will the master plan satisfy CC 2035 Policy 6 LD 1?

25:18Thank you very much.

25:22Good afternoon, Council President and council members.

25:24My name is Conrad Lasota and I'm a resident of District 4.

25:27I play hockey, my son plays hockey, and I have many friends that make skating a big part of their life.

25:33So I have a profound appreciation for the depth of community that's at an ice rink.

25:38I'm also founder and president of the Oregon Rinks Initiative, a local nonprofit with our mission to increase access to ice sports in Oregon.

25:46And so with the imminent closure of the Lloyd Center, obviously that came to our attention and it's really a call to action.

25:53I've had the privilege of getting to know the members of the Save Lloyd Ice Coalition in the last couple of months, and they are passionate, they're determined, and they are about to lose the heart of what brings them together.

26:04So today I'm here in support of the appeal filed by the Save Lloyd Ice Coalition against the Design Commission's approval of the Lloyd Center redevelopment master plan, a plan that makes no provisions for preserving or replacing a beloved ice rink that's been anchored in this community for 65 years.

26:20Thank you.

26:21In times like this, I think it's important to reflect on the past, and Portland has been here before.

26:26The city was once home to the largest public ice arena in the world in the Portland Hippodrome on 20th and Marshall that opened in 1914.

26:35And this would be the start of a rich Portland history in figure skating and ice hockey.

26:40And it would also bring world accolades with figure skating competitions and even the first U.S. hockey team to play for the Stanley Cup came from Portland, Oregon.

26:47However, the Hippodrome would close and Portland would be left without a community ice rink for nearly a decade until, of course, the Lloyd Center opened its doors.

26:56And it was also a first to be— that came a lot faster than I expected, sorry.

27:03Also became the first rink, a mall to— a rink that was in a mall in the world.

27:10So I think just leveraging the importance of what the rink is to our community, My name is James Haskell.

27:34I'm submitting testimony in defense of the appellants for case LU25-091308CCMSAD.

27:42My comments are in reference to the ordinance number.

27:44To Criterion H1 and H2.

27:46The destruction of the ice rink and the Lloyd Center goes against the Central City 2035 Policies 3.LD-2 and 5.LD-1.

27:55Destroying the ice rink and the Lloyd Center along with it shall remove the one indoor ice skating rink in Portland and make it difficult for the ice skating community to thrive.

28:03Please find a way to preserve or relocate the ice rink.

28:07The destruction of the Lloyd Center is in violation of the Central City Fundamental Design Guidelines A2, A5, A6, and the Lloyd District Design Guidelines A5-1 and A5-8.

28:19Removing the Lloyd Center from the port— from Portland destroys an important theme of resiliency in changing times and does not enhance, embellish, or identify this unique building.

28:28The Lloyd Center's multi-story design can be renovated, rehabilitated, and reused.

28:33It does not need to be torn down.

28:35The infrastructure is already there.

28:37If the landowners and developers move forward with destroying the Lloyd Center and restoring and rehabilitating the Lloyd Center shall see immediate return on investment.

28:48The Lloyd Center is a feature of Portland and needs to continue being so.

28:52You cannot integrate the Lloyd Shopping Center into the Lloyd District when it no longer exists.

28:56It is impossible to follow these design guidelines without the place they were created for.

29:00Thank you, councilors, for your time.

29:03Thank you very much.

29:05Lisa Stein.

29:25Welcome.

29:26Please go ahead.

29:27You can go ahead, Lisa.

29:30Good afternoon.

29:31My name is Lisa Stein.

29:33I'm a District 2 resident, having lived in the Beaumont-Wilshire neighborhood for 40 years.

29:38As a resident of Northeast Portland, it has been a delight to view and visit the many architectural projects dotting our skyline which Zimmer/Gonzo Frasca has designed.

29:48The Bonneville Power Administration headquarters, the convention center, Portland International Airport, and soon to join the list, the Ballmer Institute at U of O Portland campus, which broke ground June 12th.

30:01Sadly, I do not see in the plans for the redevelopment of Lloyd Mall the hallmarks I have come to expect from the ZGF project.

30:08Thank you.

30:09Innovation, inspiration, and community engagement.

30:14Which begs the question, what's up?

30:18Architects are given a canvas by those who are purchasing their design services.

30:23They reflect in their plans the requests of their employers.

30:27It seems obvious to this observer that what is valued by those of us who frequent Lloyd Center on a weekly basis is not clearly reflected by those who have contracted ZGS to design a remodel.

30:38Councilwoman Smith, not to mention the fact that the original deed to Lloyd property expressly noted that an ice rink was to be at the core of any future development.

30:47As the council considers these appeals, I implore you to send the current plans back to the Design Commission.

30:52Allow ZGF to create new schematics that reflect the best hopes for Lloyd Mall.

30:57Thank you for your time.

31:04My name is Paul Cienfuegos.

31:06Here are some relevant facts that you might have forgotten or never knew.

31:09The 2 giant corporations that currently control Lloyd Center have been turning away numerous business owners all year who wanted to rent shop space there.

31:19Barnes Noble had no plans to close their bookstore, but the mall refused to renew their lease.

31:23The Ross Dress for Less store had not intended to close its doors, but again, the corporate owners paid them a lot of money to get them to leave.

31:31Here are the actual words spoken by Tom Kilbane, managing director of Urban Renaissance Corporation, in his talk at the PDX Design Collaborative last year talking about the Ross Store, which you can watch on YouTube.

31:43They didn't want to let that go cheaply, but we finally came to terms and got them out of the way.

31:48A lot of what we've done over the past 2 years has been removing encumbrances that were preventing any redevelopment from happening.

31:56That has been a big focus.

31:58Tom was talking in corporate speak.

32:00Here's my translation.

32:02Our goal was to push out the existing tenants whether they wanted to go or not, so that we could flatten this beloved building and redevelop it in a way that erases 66 years of history and maximizes our profits.

32:15Let's be very clear.

32:16For the past year, Lloyd Center has not been dying.

32:19It's being actively killed by 2 giant absentee corporations, one of whom has repeatedly lied to the ice skating community.

32:27I keep asking myself, what would Mayor Zoran Mamdani do in this situation?

32:32You know what he'd do.

32:32He'd deny the application.

32:34And so should you.

32:35The Save Lloyd website contains a detailed alternative plan concept that preserves the core portion of Lloyd Center, including the beloved ice rink, while allowing the extremities to be redeveloped for housing and other community priorities.

32:47I urge you to review that plan before making your decision.

32:50Thank you.

32:51Thank you very much.

32:56My name is Terry Parker.

32:58You know, it rains a lot in Portland.

33:00As a long-life Portlander, I think there is a better basic design for the Lloyd Center area than the one presented by the current owners.

33:11To start with, the former Myron Frank's building, former JCPenney's, then Sears building, and the former Woolworth's building could all be replaced with multi-unit housing structures that could be directly connected to the mall, inclusive of lobby doors opening up into the existing concourses.

33:26Councilmember Wilson.

33:27With Safeway a couple of blocks away as a place to purchase groceries, the inside of the mall itself could remain a gathering space with coffee and snack shops, a nice restaurant or two, a pharmacy, a childcare center and/or preschool, and possibly activity centers or an arcade for older kids.

33:44The enclosed mall could be catered to the basic daily needs for the residents of new housing and nearby offices.

33:51Since the mall would also remain accessible to the general public, optimistically, inclusive of a direct connection to the new performing arts center at the west end.

34:01Additional spaces in the mall could be utilized for retail starts and incubators for small businesses.

34:06Offices could still be remained on the upper floors.

34:09This concept preserves the ice rink, the historical legacy of the Lloyd Center Mall, and presents a style of living where most daily needs can be met within a few dry steps of housing, thereby reducing travel and congestion on city streets.

34:22With total demolition of the mall, a 10-year plan, and the property subdivided, a risk exists whereby individual land blocks could be sold to who knows who or what other developer might want to build on them.

34:34Finally, you wouldn't want to run a bulldozer through all of downtown Portland just because of a few empty storefronts and office spaces, nor would you want to replace Pioneer Square with a grassy lawn.

34:44Thank you.

34:45Thank you, Tim.

34:48Angela's online.

34:49You can go ahead.

34:51Hello everybody, I am Angela Ellaby, she/her.

34:55I am chair of the board of the Northeast Coalition of Neighborhoods.

35:00The Northeast Coalition of Neighborhoods represents 28 neighborhoods and nonprofits in District 2.

35:07We have taken a vote and signed a previous appeal of the demolition of Lloyd Center.

35:12Most of the board members have told me the value of the Lloyd center as it is now, serving as a nucleus for small businesses, providing parking, and the wonderful ice rink.

35:24Many of us in the new District 2 have grown up enjoying the mall as it grew and blossomed over the years.

35:30Many other cities have redeveloped malls in creative ways.

35:34Some turned them into affordable housing without demolition.

35:38The board of the Northeast Coalition in past years was approached by other developers wanting to build up the area that's now fenced off cinema parking lot.

35:48Those developers actually had planned drawings on what they wanted to build and the place of that lot.

35:54That was years ago, yet no development happened.

35:58In this difficult 2026 economy, it has become increasingly hard for would-be developers to find workers and even find materials to build with.

36:08Fast forward to today, And, uh, things that were affordable 5 years ago are unaffordable, as I was told by a city employee.

36:18In short, we oppose the demolition of the mall and the ice rink.

36:25Thank you very much.

36:29Maddie Garrison, Natalia Piramova, Leanne Widlick, Krista Catwood, Alex Rios-Gabra, Leanne Calandrella-Sleva.

36:46Welcome, folks.

36:49Who wants to jump in first?

36:53Oh, me first?

36:54Oh, okay.

36:54I'm a Leo, so I guess that means I'm— I gotta do this.

36:57Um, I'm grateful for my chosen family that I've made here in Portland.

37:02Sure to introduce yourself for the record, sorry.

37:04Oh, my name for the record is Matty Garrison.

37:07I am someone that is a potential, like, occupant of this building as someone that wants to start a creative business.

37:16And what I have seen in this center is not an abandonment.

37:20I've seen community, I've seen people make something out of nothing.

37:23I've seen resilience.

37:25As someone that is a survivor of domestic violence and a mom that was affected by it, I am a creative and a leader in it, in that, in that realm of things.

37:34I take her same badassery as I fight the good fight, though she could shred in surfing a lot more than me.

37:41I can only swim in the ocean.

37:47Um, in my 12— 10 to 12 years of being on the ground fighting domestic violence, I almost lost it all to the egos I've had to manage, including my own.

37:55I should not be alive.

37:57That is actual resistance to the systems at play here.

38:02The respect I receive is due to the integrity and accountability I hold myself to.

38:07With 19 cents in my bank account on Section 8, to quote Jalen Brunson, the job is not done yet.

38:15When you run for mayor, the job starts when you become mayor, not as you're running for mayor.

38:21Thank you.

38:22All right.

38:24So I plan on announcing my plans for how I would want to use Lloyd Center for our community in bringing people of the Ronald Reagan era into a place from surviving to thriving.

38:36Thank you for your time.

38:38Let's save Lloyd Center together.

38:40Also, respectfully, Council President, I'm also bad at numbers, but I'm really fucking elite when it comes to attention to detail.

38:49Thank you.

38:51Go.

38:52Let's go.

38:55All right.

38:57Hello, councilors.

38:58My name is Krista Catwood.

39:00A year and a half ago, I started a weekly retro mall walking group at the Lloyd Center Mall.

39:05Today, 30 to 200 people of all ages and abilities gather to connect, to laugh, and move in what has become Portland's largest community center.

39:15Our group shares the food court each week with chess players, gamers, yo-yo masters, crafters, zine makers, fan clubs, and community organizations.

39:25In a time when third spaces are disappearing, Lloyd Center provides something increasingly rare.

39:30It provides a free, accessible, climate-controlled place where people can gather and build real-world connections.

39:37This creative use of space has drawn national attention.

39:40People now visit from across the country and make a joy-filled mall walk at the Lloyd A part of their Portland itinerary.

39:48They leave inspired by what's happening here and by the possibilities it represents, eager to bring it back home to their own communities.

39:56Yet the redevelopment plans before you leave no room for a community that exists there, and it eliminates spaces for low-barrier indoor gatherings, for the ice rink, and for the vibrant culture that has emerged.

40:07I've been invited to speak in Toronto this fall at a major summit of transit leaders, planners, and community advocates on what we've built at the Lloyd Center.

40:16People are watching Portland.

40:19We can build housing and preserve community.

40:22Let's show them what that looks like.

40:25I urge you to appeal the approval of the master plan and instead create a path for collaboration, transparency, and innovative compromise.

40:34Thank you.

40:35Thank you.

40:40Good afternoon, City Council members.

40:42My name is Alex Guerrero Rios, and I'm speaking on behalf of the appeal against the Lloyd Center master plan.

40:48While I recognize the need for revitalization and new housing in, in our city, I urge you to reject the total demolition of the Lloyd Center.

40:54The Lloyd community is so rich and beautiful, full of all walks of life coming together to skate, socialize, paint, sculpt, create, or just shop around.

41:02For decades, this space has been more than just an aging mall.

41:05It is a vital community hub, a third space home away from home, and a beloved sanctuary not only to me but to everyone who has stepped foot inside its walls.

41:12The indoor ice rink is a rare Portland institution providing accessible recreation, community connection, and a vital safe haven for the youth.

41:19Furthermore, with the rising summer temperatures, the mall currently serves as an essential indoor cooling and gathering space for the vulnerable neighbors.

41:26Demolishing the entire 29-acre site erases a core piece of our city's cultural history.

41:30We need to come together to find solutions instead of being in constant conflict.

41:33We don't have to choose between housing and our heritage.

41:36The City Council has the power to hold developers accountable, and all we ask is that you send the master plan back to the drawing board to acquire a compromise, one that builds the necessary housing and parks while preserving and integrating the existing mall structure and its beloved ice rink.

41:49If Moda Center is the body and mind, then Lloyd Center Mall is the heart and soul of the city of Portland, and therefore it deserves to have a place to coexist and exist for the future generation of people, kids, and families to come.

41:59Thank you for your time and for your commitment to a vibrant, inclusive Portland.

42:02Thank you.

42:03Thank you very much.

42:05And for the record, this is— in my 32 years of living here in Portland, this is my first time public speaking.

42:11So this is how important this is to me.

42:14Welcome to City Hall.

42:16Go ahead.

42:17Hey, thank you, Council.

42:19My name is Leanne Weidlich.

42:20I'm a lifelong Portland resident, a business owner, and a single mom with a 12-year-old creative kid with autism.

42:29I have fought through a housing crisis Rising cost of living just to raise my daughter in the city and the community that I grew up in.

42:39We specifically found a home in Sullivan's Gulch, which is walking distance to Lloyd Center, so my kid could have that sense of place to come of age.

42:48This is the only space that I can comfortably let a preteen roam on their own and gain that important independence and autonomy.

42:58Thank you.

42:58It's the only indoor place that I can take my elderly father just to relax, to socialize, and just to exist in a public space without any monetary expectations.

43:09And just a note, this is a cooling shelter officially and unofficially.

43:13This is where we give notice to people that are in an emergency situation.

43:17But for myself, I got home yesterday, my home was almost 90 degrees.

43:21We go to Lloyd Center every other day.

43:24What's happening at Lloyd in recent years is inspiring, innovative.

43:28Thank you.

43:29Exemplifies the values and the goals of our cities.

43:31Small business, community groups have flourished.

43:33They've built a community that cannot be manufactured.

43:36My daughter is in an amazing art program right now, currently involved in summer camp.

43:41These programs are more accessible, more affordable than any other resource in the community.

43:48It's now just gaining national attention from so many creative circles and niche groups.

43:53Please Keep Lloyd Center— keep Portland community-driven, keep it a beacon of sustainability, keep it weird, and keep Portland.

44:02Thank you very much.

44:13Welcome.

44:15City Council members, my name is Siddharth Seshikumar, or Sid for short, and I am testifying as an informal representative of Portland's Democratic Socialists of America chapter as well as Oregon State University's YDSA chapter.

44:26I want to speak on the matter from both my own perspective as well as that of fellow civically minded working-class students, despite being Corvallis, because I think that true advocacy and activism is worth braving the commute.

44:37As a dual pre-med and pre-law graduate student who commutes to Portland regularly to link up with family in Bethany to seek out job opportunities as a potential medical assistant, I rely on the Lloyd Center constantly just to study, purchase books, and de-stress.

44:51To me and many of my peers, it is a vital workspace for climate and public health research and a rare, weather-insulated place where adolescents and young adults like myself can foster small communities and congregate without a price tag being attached.

45:04Coming from a college student, just trust me, it's really hard to come by these kind of places.

45:09To put it simply, NECC stated that demolishing 1.2 million square feet of viable retail infrastructure is an act of environmental violence and will destroy local morale.

45:17Construction demolition waste accounts for a staggering portion of municipal solid waste streams, and under Oregon Statewide Planning Goal 6, the city is legally erasing the embodied carbon of this massive concrete structure only to truck it to a landfill and rebuild it from scratch directly contradicts Portland's own climate emergency declaration.

45:37It is ecological malpractice that is being masqueraded as progress.

45:41Several others have already pointed this out by now, but as an appellant, I contend that the Design Commission's intended plan violates Portland City Code Title 33, specifically the Central City Master Plan criteria regarding infrastructure capacity and neighborhood economic continuity.

45:54You cannot claim to support local culture while rubber stamping displacement of the city's working class, many of whom take the time to speak to you just today and yesterday.

46:03I urge the council to uphold this appeal, reject the current master plan, send it back for exhaustive review that prioritizes adapt— Sorry, thank you very much.

46:12Sorry, thank you very much.

46:17Albert Kaufman, Rebecca Morin, Ali Fakri, Noelle Muzzy, Boz Epley, Janelle Collier.

46:35Welcome.

46:38Thank you.

46:41My name is Boz Epley.

46:42Good afternoon, Council.

46:44I'm here today as a District 2 voter and Irvington neighbor.

46:47I'd like to present some context on the real estate market in my testimony today.

46:52KKR and URG's master plan implies that the redevelopment of the Lloyd Center is in progress, but this is simply not true.

46:58The master plan is speculative fiction.

47:00Neither URG nor KKR has any plan to redevelop Lloyd.

47:04The master plan to them is the next step to demolition and selling the lots.

47:08Unfortunately, no one wants them.

47:09Councilor Smith.

47:10KKR and URG have not disclosed buyers or even potentially interested parties.

47:15There's evidence of low interest in already available Portland land, including vacant lots and low-income housing in the Lloyd District.

47:22URG bought a downtown building for nearly $10 million in 2018, and in 2023 it was auctioned for bankruptcy and no one showed up to buy it.

47:32The Lloyd Cinemas parking lot, a 5-acre site, is approved for 20-story towers.

47:36Over 10 years ago, the California developer promised, quote, the most magnificent mixed-use development in Portland, end quote, with 1,000 residential units.

47:46In 2019, the lender foreclosed for non-payment, and no buyer has stepped forward for 7 years.

47:51A low-income affordable housing tower blocks from Lloyd Center, managed by Home Forward, has one of the highest vacancy rates in their portfolio.

47:59KKR and URG have acted in bad faith.

48:02They are not phasing development and don't meaningfully engage with the community.

48:07Please send this back.

48:08Don't spend your political capital and tarnish your legacy for out-of-state and out-of-touch financial interests.

48:16Thank you.

48:20Good afternoon.

48:22I'm Janelle Collier, and I have lived in Irvington since 1981.

48:28And I started going to the Lloyd Center pretty quickly to find things to do with my 5-year-old daughter.

48:34And I'm here to ask you why you would demolish a perfectly good space that was recently remodeled.

48:42Your policies are clear that existing buildings should be reused and restored when feasible, and the Lloyd Center is more than just feasible.

48:52It has become a place of community and goodwill.

48:56For example, there's a magic store where you can watch magicians, a Lego store that has free summer camps for underprivileged children, a comic store where you can browse to your heart's content and chat with the owner, a game store where you can sit and play the games as well as buy them, an ice rink where you can take your children and then your grandchildren for a fun afternoon and I'm sure that there is more that I don't know about.

49:24And you can buy a big box of caramel corn as you leave to enjoy at home.

49:29You can do all this in a comfortable setting, no matter what the weather, and in a safe environment.

49:35The historic Lloyd Center is still loved and enjoyed from the young, like my 20-year-old grandson and his friends, to the very old, like my 100-year-old church friends.

49:46Just ask the over 10,000 people who signed our petition or sent in written testimony, or those of us who have taken the time to come in with oral testimony.

49:58The community you have heard from are trusting you to do the right thing.

50:03Please do not sit back with fond memories of the past, but instead help us to move forward with a new vision for the future.

50:11Please help us.

50:15Thank you very much for being here.

50:19In the chamber, if I could please ask, we could revert more to jazz hands or whatever, less, less, less clapping.

50:28Thank you.

50:30Hello, my name is Noelle Muzzy.

50:32I'm an environmental scientist and a District 2 resident, and today I'd like to ask the council to send back the current master plan.

50:38To me, I personally oppose URG's plan 'cause I think it's a very clear environmental injustice.

50:43We have a community space that has been slowly being rebuilt by community organizations and several small business owners who have clearly established some amazing things in the Lloyd Center.

50:54However, they're losing all of that because some investment group has decided that it's not making them enough money anymore.

51:00So by appealing it, you will not only be helping all of those constituents and helping build a better space where these small business owners can start making more profit, and a space that serves many more of your constituents than Justice Investment Group, but it's also in line with your own criteria and design criteria.

51:19Specifically, if you look at Policy 1, I believe, let me look up the numbers again, Policy 1 LD1, Policy 1 LD2, and A2, which are referring to housing, employment, innovation, and economy in Portland character, if I have my notes correctly.

51:35Yes.

51:36This Lloyd Center, Portland is a scrappy artistic city.

51:38And so having this renovated mall that is full of small businesses and people who have found ways to make their side hustles turn them a profit is something that your constituents will appreciate much more than some empty lot that'll eventually turn into whoever buys it next.

51:54So, you know, a Shake Shack, a Chili's, like someone with a lot of money who's gonna buy those instead of— Yeah.

52:04Thank you very much.

52:09Ali, you can go ahead online.

52:13Hello.

52:14Yeah, my name is Ali Fakri.

52:15I'm a small business owner.

52:17I'm a Lloyd Center tenant.

52:19I'm a single father who has been struggling, especially, uh, since that information was spread about destroying the Lloyd Center.

52:30I'm a single father.

52:30I have a 2-year-old daughter.

52:31I mean, as a tenant in that mall, you know, a lot of things are wrong because like you see customers come, they're like, oh, we heard that, you know, the mall was already closed.

52:45I've been hearing this like for the past 3 years.

52:48So it's not motivating.

52:50So, you know, like I know that we are very close to the DoubleTree Hotel.

52:56Yes.

52:56The convention center, you know, and the Moda Center.

53:01All those places do bring a lot of people, conventioners, you know, not just locally.

53:06Originally, I've met people coming like from all over the world just for the day.

53:11They stopped today in Portland, tomorrow they're going elsewhere.

53:14So all— most of the time they lodge in that radius.

53:18So like they don't drive, you know, like, and then they just want to come to the mall.

53:21Okay.

53:22Buy something and leave.

53:24Those are potential buyers, not like just window shoppers.

53:27But lately they come, they cannot find anything because almost everybody is gone.

53:32Please, councilors, try to do something for this mall because this is our mall.

53:36That's what we have.

53:38I mean, like, we are not looking for making like billions.

53:41For myself, I'm just trying to make the thrill that will allow me to keep going on a daily basis, to allow my son To be able to pursue his soccer dream, my daughter to be able to pursue her acrobatic dreams.

53:55Please, you know, like as that order, Maracanã, said it.

54:02Thank you very much for being here today.

54:03Their actual history.

54:05Thank you very much.

54:07Thanks for, thanks for your testimony.

54:12Stephanie Winningham.

54:14Lisa Kadai, Kai Kaufman, Amy Bennett, Bat Graves, Grace Mason, and Melanie Reyes.

54:24You can go ahead and take a seat.

54:29My name is Stephanie Winningham, a resident of Vancouver, Washington.

54:32At the age of 30, I stepped onto the ice as a figure skater for the first time.

54:36In just 2 and a half years, I am now preparing to compete at the U.S. National Showcase this August.

54:43I think you've heard and seen so much about what makes the ice skating community so extraordinary and how it sets an example of what a community should be.

54:52Yet it is still something even more fierce to behold in person.

54:56But I want to remind you that this is not just a niche community of skaters and parents.

55:01Everyone starts as a public recreational skater.

55:04This is not— this is for all of Portland, an invaluable piece of infrastructure.

55:09Lloyd Center's Learn to Skate program is the 2nd largest in the Pacific Northwest, only surpassed by the NHL Kraken program, and is made up of approximately 80 to 90% women and girls.

55:20In a still very male-dominated world where city planners are turning to more gender-inclusive urban planning, the loss of the ice rink will disproportionately affect women and girls.

55:30We are not against affordable housing.

55:33We are not against redevelopment.

55:34We want our community and communities like ours that make Portland the amazing place that drew my family to the Pacific Northwest and draws my family to cross the river 6 to 8 times a week.

55:46We want to be considered in the developmental process.

55:49Please help to retain, replace, or relocate our incredible Portland Ice community.

55:54Don't just preserve a place to skate, preserve a place where future generations will discover community, confidence, and belonging, just as I did.

56:02Thank you.

56:06I request more time.

56:07My name is Amy Bennett.

56:09I live in District 4.

56:10I moved to Portland in 2011.

56:12Your names are on this project, whether you give the city a 29-acre, 3-story, multimillion-dollar ecological Superfund site and disaster that you and we taxpayers will have to pay for, or you let ice skaters keep skating.

56:27You give us our beautiful mall.

56:29You let us keep our businesses, our families, our incomes, our homes.

56:32Councilmember Bennett, you have 2 minutes remaining.

56:35Before you allow KKR and URG, if I've said that wrong, you— I mean Urban Renaissance Group— to do anything, especially demolish and claim a tax credit for this quarter, I want you to audit them financially.

56:52Have some accountants and some stockbrokers take a look at this company and their reputation.

56:58You need to reappraise with a real estate appraiser the Lloyd Center prior to demolition to see just exactly what are they destroying and just exactly how much are they trying to claim for this quarter as a tax write-off.

57:13Then they will rent off the building and sell it.

57:16Lloyd Center is the only district in Portland that has recovered since COVID it could be a Macy's Hotel boutique, amazing renovated rooms decorated by artists, Meow Wolf type space right next to hotels.

57:31It could be an international artist collective and destination point.

57:34Ross could be a Tuesday It could be cocktail bars after hours.

57:44It could be a night space as well for 21-and-up people.

57:48It could be senior adaptive living on one layer, and right below that it could be inclusive community housing for adults with disabilities who are now outside the city center.

57:58I would love to see beautiful things.

57:59It's the only place— Thank you very much.

58:01Thank you very much for your testimony today.

58:05Thank you.

58:07Thank you.

58:09Thank you.

58:12Thank you.

58:25Lisa Kadai is online.

58:26You can go ahead.

58:37Hi, Lisa, you can go ahead.

58:40Okay, can you hear me okay?

58:41We can.

58:43All right, hi, hi, my name is Lisa Kadai.

58:46Thank you for this opportunity to speak with you today.

58:49When I was 24, I moved to Troutdale for my first job.

58:53However, one year later, I moved to Northeast Portland.

58:56I wanted to be closer to the Lloyd Center, which is saying a lot because I'm not a mall person.

59:01I wanted to be closer to there, specifically the ice rink.

59:04I was there in order to learn to skate, and I skated almost every day.

59:08City of Portland has a great sort of policies and goals that make this a wonderful place to live.

59:13It's got distinctive urban places, open space and recreation, and its identity and sense of space.

59:19The ice rink contributes directly to all these goals, as well as the Lloyd Center.

59:22What better place to recreate?

59:24What better place to socialize than with established 65-year-old community?

59:29And let's not forget the history that contributes to identity and sense of space.

59:34Um, the ice rink may not be a profitable business or earn lots of money, but it is an important community resource, much like a community pool or a rec center.

59:45The ice rink has helped dream of Northeast Portland, and I'm sure it has done others.

59:48I was shocked when no rink was included in the master plan.

59:52Our ask is that approval of this plan be contingent on saving the core of the mall with the ice rink or rebuilding the rink.

59:58I ask, is there really nothing the city can do with the private property when so many have spoken their support for this historic building and the historic ice rink?

1:00:08This is saying a lot.

1:00:09I don't usually speak for— this is my very first civic matter.

1:00:12It means that much to me.

1:00:14Thank you for your timely consideration.

1:00:16Thank you very much.

1:00:21Grace Mason, you can go ahead online.

1:00:31Oh, sorry, I'm trying to figure this out.

1:00:33Here we go.

1:00:36Okay, um, sorry, I'm, I'm kind of shaking.

1:00:39Uh, it doesn't show where the time is on my thing.

1:00:43It, it hasn't started yet.

1:00:45Okay, sorry, I can't see a timer anywhere.

1:00:48Um, okay, uh, good afternoon, council members.

1:00:53My name is Grace.

1:00:54I am a Portland native, a mother, and a former foster youth who aged out of the system directly into homelessness.

1:01:00Someone earlier noted in the council that nobody went over to Lloyd Center after the hearing, but the truth is, is that my family and my community doesn't need a special trip.

1:01:09We live it every single day, and I strongly oppose the destructive master plan.

1:01:13As a kid, my grandmother and would share a Cinnabon treat right after the orthodontist checkups there on the 3rd floor.

1:01:19Later, when I was unhoused because I aged out of foster care, that transit hub was my physical lifeline.

1:01:26Every day I'd walk through Macy's, spray a little perfume to keep appearances up before going into my job over at Wilson's Leather.

1:01:32That mall helped me hold on to the dignity of what little dignity I had left because of the system— the systemic circumstances completely out of my control.

1:01:42Today I see more unhoused youth on our streets than ever before.

1:01:46Lloyd Center was designated— was designed in 1960 as a city within a city so that everything could be within walking distance.

1:01:52But developers say that renovation— when— sorry, uh, when they really mean renovation, when they really mean gentrification, it will only push out the space built for all walks of life, as price-out exposes in the expensive development just displace families.

1:02:09That film featured Nikki Williams, a fierce— uh, sorry, I was getting a call— a fierce, uh, advocate we lost recently.

1:02:18And her daughter Bree Williams is my friend and running for Multnomah County Commissioner for District 2 to fight that exact displacement.

1:02:24I'm— last paragraph, I'm sorry.

1:02:27Uh, looking at Washington Square and Clackamas Town Center, those suburban malls are thriving.

1:02:31Why do wealthy neighborhoods keep up their hubs while our inner space city is demolished.

1:02:36We're surrounded by the Moda Center, convention, and other places, and travelers from all over the world lodge in this exact radius and want a place to walk.

1:02:46Thank you so much for being here today, Grace.

1:02:47Sorry.

1:02:48Thank you.

1:02:50Natalia.

1:02:51Natalia Piramova.

1:02:52My 7-year-old is deaf and her— That's time for Grace.

1:02:56Natalia Piramova, you can go ahead.

1:03:10Hi, Natalia, you can unmute.

1:03:16You're good to go.

1:03:18Good afternoon.

1:03:19Uh, can you guys hear me okay?

1:03:20We can.

1:03:21Uh, my name is Natalia Pyramova, and I'm here today to urge you to To grant this appeal and deny approval of the Lloyd Center Master Plan.

1:03:29This application is not a plan for development.

1:03:31It's the process of the financialization of real estate playing out in real time, treating 27 acres of our city not as a community anchor, but as a short-term asset to be maximized for investor exit value.

1:03:43Once this master plan is rubber stamped, Urban Renaissance Group will take its speculative profits and bail.

1:03:48This model stands in direct aggressive conflict with Policy 2LD3 of the Central City Plan, Community building, which mandates that development must foster a vibrant public realm that strengthens community identity.

1:04:00To see what that actually looks like, you can take a look at my daughter, who says, "Mommy, can we go to Lloyd Center?" Almost every day, and it's not just the toy store that she's after.

1:04:09What she's really asking for is to be around the people.

1:04:12It's the community gathered around that historic rink, the window shopping, seeing people who are not like her.

1:04:17This is probably the last place in Portland that's a true third.

1:04:22And malls across America prove you don't need a wrecking ball to modernize.

1:04:28They're being revitalized into vibrant, vibrant civic hubs through cultural pop-ups and creative market activations.

1:04:33And we have the opportunity for Lloyd Center to be the bones of that example.

1:04:38Uh, we can see what's going to happen here.

1:04:41We can practically see the gravel lot and the weeds growing.

1:04:44Why does our city's review process even exist if not to enforce our standards against exactly this type of speculation?

1:04:49Councilmember Smith, I'm sorry, I have to interrupt you.

1:04:50Please hold this applicant true to the intent of our land use laws and deny this master plan.

1:04:54Thank you.

1:04:56Thank you very much.

1:05:01Pause one second.

1:05:02We have— the chambers have gotten muted.

1:05:05Thank you, we're unmuted.

1:05:06You can go ahead.

1:05:07Next, Bat Graves.

1:05:16Looks like you are still on mute.

1:05:19You're still muted.

1:05:21Am I unmuted?

1:05:23Now we can hear you.

1:05:25Okay, wonderful.

1:05:27Uh, good afternoon, City Council.

1:05:29My name is Bat Graves.

1:05:30I'm a born and raised Portland stakeholder, artist, business owner, and displaced Native resident of 30-plus years.

1:05:38I am here in absolute opposition to the optional demolition framework under case file LU25-091308CCMSAD.

1:05:47We do not require more speculative high-density residential clearcuts while Native Portlanders are actively displaced by this very type of gentrifying development.

1:05:55Look directly across the street at the failing theater parking lot.

1:05:58We cannot submit this city to further economic liability by gambling on premature demolition before a concept is finalized, funded, and legally tied down.

1:06:07Instead, Portland must optimize our preexisting turnkey infrastructure to capture the regional market.

1:06:12As Seattle's International District faces instability, we can conflate to preserve the structural integrity of Interior Lock Bridge 902 through 996, hosting our iconic ice rink, to host a vibrant indoor international cultural hub centering the asset by utilizing targeted preservation marketing to actively promote this existing third space as mandated by code.

1:06:35Conversely, the city's desired open-air transit and bicycle networks can be strictly isolated along the underutilized Multnomah Corridor while maintaining the 9th and Halsey structures as mandatory parking infrastructure.

1:06:46Thank you.

1:06:47To comply explicitly with the Central City 235 plan, you must mandate a binding preservation addendum protecting our legacy cultural pinnacles, anchors like the historic ice rink and its 10K addendum signatures, Joe's Brown Century Old Portland Grown Legacies, Lloyd Houses, and 30+ active businesses, communities, and the Portland Interactive Conservation Group that actively prove complying independent revenue right now.

1:07:15Support your constituents, our culture, Portland's culture, Thank you very much for being here today.

1:07:24Kai Kaufman.

1:07:26Kai, you can unmute.

1:07:26Go ahead.

1:07:31Hi there.

1:07:33Am I, uh, ready to go?

1:07:35Ready to go.

1:07:36Okay.

1:07:37Hi, my name is Kai Kaufman, and I'm a socially engaged artist and founder of Planet Lloyd, a free community newspaper written by Lloyd Mall fans across the city.

1:07:46I've produced over 10 participatory art projects at Lloyd and can safely say there's no other place in the city or even the world that unites local human rights groups, social clubs, children's play spaces, art programs and art galleries, music schools, resources for trans people, BIPOC communities, the unhoused, and people with disabilities under one roof.

1:08:09This is what I lovingly call the People's Lloyd, and the People's Lloyd is a living emblem of Portland themes as per Guideline A2.7.

1:08:17Thank you.

1:08:18What you're hearing in these testimonies is the very certain magic that happens when citizens gather and mingle in indoor public space.

1:08:29Chance encounters, cross-cultural connection, the chance to be seen and understood, and like you heard from many of the ice skaters, unexpected discoveries that can change the course of your life.

1:08:40The magic I'm talking about, those Portland themes, doesn't happen in solely indoor spaces.

1:08:44Thank you.

1:08:47Thank you very much.

1:09:07That concludes appellant testimony.

1:09:09All right.

1:09:11We are now moving into the presentation from the applicant, I believe.

1:09:18Welcoming— I believe we're welcoming Allison Rouse, Tom Kilbane, Nolan Leinhardt, and Christy White.

1:09:27First?

1:09:28Yeah.

1:09:29Good timing.

1:09:41While the applicants are getting set up, I want to note for the record that the 2 appellant presentations went over time by 49 seconds, so we've added that to the applicant's time.

1:09:53So they have a total on the timer of 30 minutes, 49 seconds.

1:09:56Thank you very much.

1:10:00Welcome.

1:10:01Thank you.

1:10:01Are we ready?

1:10:02Yeah, take it away.

1:10:05Council President Dunphy, members of council, good afternoon.

1:10:08My name is Tom Kilbane.

1:10:10I'm with Urban Renaissance Group, and we are leading the master planning effort and the redevelopment of the Lloyd Center Mall site.

1:10:21We started our firm in 2006.

1:10:23Over the past 20 years, we have led the redevelopment or construction of a dozen office buildings and one apartment building The total investment that we and our partners have made during that time is more than $400 million.

1:10:38These investments have created thousands of jobs in Portland for construction workers, architects, and countless other contractors and service providers, and have also created workspaces for some of Portland's leading companies.

1:10:51We're here today because we believe in Portland and its future.

1:10:56The Lloyd Center master plan, unanimously approved by the Portland Design Commission, is an expression of our belief and confidence in Portland.

1:11:04It represents a new beginning for the surrounding neighborhood and will be a catalyst for the revitalization revitalization of the city.

1:11:12This is an opportunity to replace an outdated, soon-to-be-empty mall designed for a different era with a vibrant mixed-use neighborhood.

1:11:21Of needed housing, retail, public spaces, and live music.

1:11:26This plan reflects years of work and input from Lloyd Center neighbors and community groups and thousands of hours of work by professional planners, designers, and city staff, all committed to building something that is special for Portland's future at a time when it's needed most.

1:11:45Portland needs more housing of all types this plan will deliver thousands of affordable and market-rate units.

1:11:52The Lloyd neighborhood needs more active storefronts and pedestrian-friendly gathering spaces.

1:11:57Our vision creates both.

1:12:00Portlanders are asking for more public open spaces.

1:12:03This plan creates 6 acres of new parks, plazas, walkways, and areas for seasonal activities like farmers markets and outdoor skating.

1:12:13Portland needs more venues to showcase local and national artists.

1:12:17Construction is already underway on a new premier live music venue.

1:12:22Much-needed housing, more retail, new public spaces, and a stronger cultural economy together will create jobs and will strengthen the local economy and tax base that supports essential city services.

1:12:36Using very conservative assumptions about the pace of development, the low end of the estimate the city's estimate for economic activity that this project will bring to Portland is over $6 billion.

1:12:50And that $6 billion in economic activity will translate into much-needed tax revenue for the city of Portland.

1:12:58But before we can turn thoughtful planning into action and capture this economic activity, council must decide whether to trust the unanimous decision of the Design Commission or to second-guess it.

1:13:10I urge you to reject both appeals to the master plan and endorse the integrity of the city land use process, a process that we have faithfully and voluntarily followed.

1:13:23A decision to reverse or amend the Lloyd Center master plan will be watched by many and will not change the economics of the mall or whether it closes on August 8th.

1:13:33Therefore, The choice before you is this: move forward now with a well-considered plan that transforms an empty shopping mall into a vibrant new neighborhood, or create uncertainty and delay in an already lengthy planning process that will only make it more difficult to attract new investment into this project and into Portland.

1:13:55Because it's on everyone's mind and it's why we're here today, I want to speak directly to the matter of the ice rink.

1:14:02It is clear from the heartfelt testimony that we've heard over the last 2 days that the rink is a beloved feature of the mall.

1:14:09It's brought joy and memories to many, and it will be missed.

1:14:14But I want to set the record straight.

1:14:16We have been clear that preserving the existing ice rink was never part of our plan.

1:14:22Our master plan was made public in May of 2023.

1:14:25Are you able to I'm asking Nolan to put up the slide from Ben's presentation.

1:14:35The plan was presented twice in 2 separate public DARs, and that plan made it clear that the mall would be demolished.

1:14:44A key feature of our open space plan, the 12th Avenue Promenade, runs right through the middle of the site, directly through the rink.

1:14:51So the suggestion that we somehow hid the fact that the rink would remain is false.

1:14:56It has been clear for more than 3 years.

1:15:00We have from the beginning envisioned ice skating as a potential use in the redevelopment.

1:15:06The plan can accommodate seasonal ice skating, but as we have heard from the appellants, that they want year-round public ice.

1:15:14The master plan allows for the development of a permanent indoor ice rink.

1:15:19A skating rink is an allowed use.

1:15:21Just as an office building or an apartment building would be, and should a public or private entity come forward with a business plan to build and operate a new ice rink within the Lloyd Center neighborhood, we would welcome it.

1:15:35To be clear, the land use process cannot be used to mandate a new permanent ice rink be built in the Lloyd Center property any more than it can be used to require a specific restaurant or a store to be.

1:15:47Built.

1:15:47A master plan is a vision that allows for a variety of uses, not a block-by-block mandate of specific buildings or stores.

1:15:58For the past 5 years, through some of Portland's most challenging times, we have been proud to be the stewards of Lloyd Center.

1:16:07We have welcomed small businesses and organizations into the mall and supported them.

1:16:13With discounted rents, with community events, and enhanced security to help them succeed.

1:16:18And we're working closely with Prosper's Office of Small Business and the Lloyd Enhance Service District to help them find new homes when the mall closes.

1:16:29In closing, I want to repeat, we are here because we believe in the future of this city.

1:16:35Together with our eastside neighbors like OMSI and Albina Vision Trust, We want to help lead Portland's comeback.

1:16:42We urge you to end delays, endorse the unanimous decision of the Design Commission, and embrace an exciting vision for Portland's next great neighborhood.

1:16:52Thank you.

1:16:55Thanks, Tom.

1:16:56My name is Nolan Leinhardt.

1:16:58I'm Director of Planning and Urban Design for ZGF Architects.

1:17:02I've been working with a group of architects, planners, landscape architects, helping to lead the team to create the master plan over the last 4 years.

1:17:11But my— the role of Lloyd Center in my life goes back as far as I can remember.

1:17:16I grew up about a mile north of here, and this was this place where my family went for shopping.

1:17:22It's where I had my first job.

1:17:24It's where I rode past on the number 8 bus to middle school and high school.

1:17:29And I'm fortunate to be raising my family about a mile and a half north of here now.

1:17:33And so I still ride past on the number 8 bus, but now with a lot of hope for the master plan that we've been working on.

1:17:40What has not changed between the peak of this mall's performance and its role today is that it is about 18 Portland city blocks all combined into one mass that really separates the neighborhoods of Sullivan's Gulch and Irvington from the Lloyd District and the rest of the central city, severing what could be direct walking routes to the light rail station and Holiday Park, which is the largest park in the central city after Waterfront Park.

1:18:12And so as we began to think about the ways that the master plan could respond to the criteria in Portland zoning code, a big piece was breaking down that scale and returning walkability and orienting the future development toward Multnomah as the Civic Boulevard, as it's designated in the Transportation System Plan, and toward Holiday Parks.

1:18:37Since there's such a high value in the design guidelines towards orienting to open space.

1:18:42We also knew that as we reconnect the grid and reconnect the walkability, there was an opportunity to bring open space through with the 20% open space that comes along with this voluntary Central City Master Plan.

1:18:56There were a few comments yesterday thinking about this as a crown jewel of Portland's livability.

1:19:03And, you know, the photos here are just a taste of the ways in which I just don't think that makes any sense.

1:19:11This is not Waterfront Park.

1:19:13This is Harbor Drive.

1:19:15It's a relic of an era where cities were trying to privatize.

1:19:20They were trying to suburbanize.

1:19:22They were trying to be friendly to folks that would drive to a location and then stay at the center of a mall.

1:19:29And it turns its back on the surrounding neighborhoods.

1:19:32It turns its back on Multnomah, and it turns its back on Holiday Park.

1:19:36Our job was to flip that and make it a real— and frankly, the design guidelines that the city's created for the central city and the subdistrict are focused on the public realm.

1:19:48And what's inside of this building, as wonderful as parts of it are, are private.

1:19:54They're closed after— 7:00 PM, and they can exclude people if they want to.

1:20:00And what we're really creating is public realm.

1:20:03So I just want to take a moment to talk.

1:20:06You got a great briefing yesterday about what's in the plan, but in terms of the philosophy of creating it, we often produce a rendering like this that has green dots for trees and some water indicated here.

1:20:20This is necessary for people to kind of understand what it might feel like to be in a district like this.

1:20:26But fundamentally, the Central City Master Plan is a little simpler like this.

1:20:30Somebody called it boring, and sometimes it is because it's really identifying what portions of this site are going to be buildings, what portions are going to be streets, what parts are going to be open spaces, and then how does the scale and relationship of those things to one another have an opportunity to create place.

1:20:50As you can see, there's not a whole bunch of detail about this is housing, this is a hotel, things like that.

1:20:56It really is what we call an urban design framework.

1:21:01We then break that framework down into layers.

1:21:04And so this is the street plan, which identifies in the dark blue what we call the goalpost of new public streets connecting the old streets that currently dead end into the site, 11th and 13th to the south, 10th and 14th to the north.

1:21:22So we're connecting all of the public streets that currently dead end to the site to one another.

1:21:27So you will be able to move through the site.

1:21:29We're also creating a system of secondary streets, 15th, which connects to an existing signal, and then Clackamas, which would extend the city's future desire to extend the Green Loop.

1:21:43We have a system of open spaces that complement the very large Holiday Park open space.

1:21:49And then invite people to move through the site with all of our development sites really looking out onto open spaces.

1:21:56We've identified 6 so that they can all do slightly different jobs.

1:22:00And then we render those.

1:22:01Not to say that this is exactly how it's going to be designed.

1:22:05All of these buildings, all of these open spaces are individual projects that would come through Design Commission and have their own design review once we know exactly what those projects are going to be.

1:22:16Thank you.

1:22:16But it helps for us to illustrate how the scale and intention that we've assigned, the responsibility that we've assigned to all of these sites will contribute to a broader role and the ways that they contribute to the city's goals.

1:22:30And so I mentioned Clackamas is intended to take a neighborhood greenway, not the Green Loop.

1:22:3612Th is also a pedestrian street between Weidler and Broadway.

1:22:40We want to continue to extend that.

1:22:42Thank you.

1:22:42As used to be the case in the Lloyd Center, 12th, you could go over the bridge and then through Macy's, and before that it was Meijer and Frank and so on, to Holiday Park and then to the light rail station.

1:22:54And so we've thought about what is that interface between the development and Clackamas and the large open space of the commons, and then what might be the ability to walk straight from Irvington through this site to Holiday Park.

1:23:09Which you can see in the distance of this visualization.

1:23:13We also assign roles and responsibilities to the building sites.

1:23:17And so the zoning is reflective of the heights and FAR that we were given by the city in the zoning code.

1:23:24And it's— these boxes don't represent the shape of buildings, they represent the limits.

1:23:30And so just as you can see in some of the surrounding areas to the the buildings fit within those glass boxes, but we're really talking about a high level of design framework and constraints.

1:23:47And then we assign responsibilities in terms of orientation.

1:23:50And so this diagram is simply showing the ways in which the development in the district need to activate Multnomah as the civic boulevard of the Lloyd Center to orient toward the park and to put entrances around open spaces and consolidate the parking and loading entrances.

1:24:07So in the end, we have a beautiful rendering like this.

1:24:11This is what we hope it'll grow into.

1:24:13It will be the product of future developers, future architects, future landscape architects.

1:24:19But ultimately, we believe that the Central City Master Plan that we've created provides the framework for this, and we're really proud of it, and we hope you'll agree.

1:24:27Thank you.

1:24:28Thank you.

1:24:29Thank you.

1:24:30My name is Christy White.

1:24:31I'm legal counsel for the applicant, and I've got the role of responding to the legal appeal arguments.

1:24:38The appellant's lawyer argues that the design guidelines require the City Council to mandate preservation of the mall and the ice rink.

1:24:48That argument under the law is unequivocally wrong.

1:24:52The approval criteria are found in 33-510 thank you.

1:24:57Subsection H requires findings that the plan is consistent with the Lloyd District Design Guidelines and complies with the Central City Guidelines.

1:25:07There are at least 6 reasons why these guidelines cannot be used to apply to this case and force retention of the rink or the mall.

1:25:16First, there is not a single goal or policy in the design guidelines that even mentions the rink or the mall.

1:25:23An ice rink, much less requires preservation of an ice rink or the mall.

1:25:29Not a single one.

1:25:30Second, the appellant's preferred interpretation of the guidelines is legally impermissible.

1:25:37Nobody has cited these provisions of the design guidelines, but I'll do it for you now.

1:25:42The Lloyd Design Guidelines are crystal clear, and I quote from them directly, quote, the district guidelines are meant to state broad design objectives and shall not, shall not be construed as prescriptive standards.

1:25:59This means that the city cannot and must not apply the guidelines to prescribe a particular use.

1:26:06The central city design guidelines repeat the same conclusion, and I'm going to quote again: For this reason, design guidelines are qualitative statements.

1:26:15It is not the city's intent to prescribe any specific design solution through the design guidelines, end quote.

1:26:23Appellants are asking the City Council to do the very thing that the adopted guidelines expressly prohibit, and that is to apply them in a manner that mandates a specific use— an ice rink or retention of the mall.

1:26:39The appeal should be summarily rejected on those grounds alone.

1:26:43But there is more.

1:26:44Third, In another final master plan land use decision, the city rejected these very same arguments under the very same approval criteria.

1:26:55That decision was the River Place Central City Master Plan.

1:26:59There, the opponents argued that the council was authorized to and must dictate particular uses under the design guidelines, or the CCMP could not be approved under these same approval criteria.

1:27:13Council finds that the master plan process and approval criteria do not imply or express any intention to identify specific uses and their location other than open space, or require specific allocations of square footage to particular uses, and do not require specific building designs.

1:27:36Thank you.

1:27:37Councilor Smith.

1:27:38The master plan process does not require the applicant to identify what specific active uses will operate in the master plan area.

1:27:48End quote.

1:27:49In that case, the guidelines specifically mentioned a grocery store as a desired element under those guidelines.

1:27:57The council continued, quote, in a related argument, the opponents contend that the subdistrict goals create mandatory obligations To develop a specific feature, use, or element that's described in the policy.

1:28:10They're a grocery store.

1:28:12Council rejects the impotence interpretation.

1:28:14The goals and policies are not mandatory restrictions and are not applied on a site-by-site basis.

1:28:20Council then concluded that the problem with the argument is that they first prefer that the guidelines create these mandatory or specific uses, and then quote.

1:28:30Based on that mischaracterization, the appellants argue that because council didn't require a specific use like a grocery store or a public-private partnership with PSU, that the city is not making the required finding.

1:28:44Neither is correct.

1:28:46End quote.

1:28:47The opponents here are making the same argument on even more tenuous language.

1:28:51Here, no guideline identifies a specific use like in River Place.

1:28:56Which specifically called out a grocery store.

1:28:58Instead, all our guidelines are broad objectives.

1:29:01None contain any reference to an ice rink, and none authorize the city to mandate a particular use.

1:29:08That is the well-settled law.

1:29:10Guidelines are broad design objectives, can't be interpreted to dictate a particular use like an ice rink or a grocery store.

1:29:18Fourth, the Design Commission did not, quote, fake its way through the findings, as the appellant lawyer suggests.

1:29:25Please take the time to review the extraordinary work and effort that is reflected in the master plan submittal and the extensive findings of the Design Commission.

1:29:35Specifically, that's at Exhibit H9.

1:29:38It's a 17-page matrix that reviews each guideline under H1 and H2, offers factual, legal, and design analysis that demonstrates Compliance with each criteria, the city and the applicant carried their burden of proof.

1:29:54To reverse this careful study, the appellants have offered no contrary findings, only preferred conclusions and preferred uses with no foundation in the code.

1:30:06And to reverse the Design Commission's serious findings, this council would have to make an equally serious and lengthy effort to.

1:30:14Draft comprehensive findings reversing both the unanimous Design Commission and prior City Council findings on the same approval criteria under other master plans.

1:30:26Those findings would have to rely on a complete disregard for the very code language that prohibits appellant's preferred result.

1:30:35Fifth, the practical implications of this appeal illustrate why the code doesn't allow the city to dictate particular uses through a master plan.

1:30:45Appellants want the city to require us to build a public ice rink as a condition of unlocking this multi-phase, 27-acre housing, jobs, and open space development.

1:30:56In addition to the constitutional takings issues that presents, imagine the result if the city granted that request.

1:31:05It would be putting itself in at least the role of landlord and maybe purchaser of the site.

1:31:09Councilmember Herbold.

1:31:09Thank you, Mayor.

1:31:10If the city were to use eminent domain to acquire the site, would the city dictate the purchase price, the lease rate of the private property?

1:31:15Would it decide when the rink must be built, how big it is, who must build it, how much parking must be provided, and what happens if the operator defaults?

1:31:24The zoning code doesn't confer that authority on the city under any applicable criteria, and the city should not permit any party to use the zoning code or an appeal to demand property from another for its own preferred use.

1:31:41Sixth, there is good news.

1:31:44And here I want to respond to the public testimony of the ice skaters and their families, which was genuine and important.

1:31:52There's no question about that.

1:31:54There is nothing about this master plan approval that would prohibit or preclude an ice rink.

1:32:00The city regulates land use by establishing zones for each property.

1:32:05Within that zone, the city establishes broad use categories, and under those use categories, a list of permitted uses.

1:32:15An ice rink would be an entertainment-related retail sales and service use, which is allowed outright in this master plan and in the CX zone.

1:32:25In fact, the block sizes in this master plan are larger than most block sizes and would accommodate a full-size ice rink.

1:32:32Full-size ice rink.

1:32:34Despite this appeal, and I want to be sure this is on the record, the applicant will entertain all tenant interests in this redevelopment, including an ice rink, as it realizes the vision and promise of this important master plan.

1:32:50But there is a line that can't be crossed.

1:32:52We can't be required to sell or lease property to the appellant or be required to build a thank you.

1:33:01We are subject to the regulations that were in effect when we submitted this application.

1:33:05There was no regulation that required us to build an ice rink.

1:33:09There was a regulation that required us to dedicate 6 acres, 6 city blocks of our private property for public use in the form of parks and open space.

1:33:21I want to turn now to the arguments related to demolition.

1:33:25There seems to be some confusion about this.

1:33:27The CCMP is not a demolition permit.

1:33:31Therefore, any arguments regarding demolition are not legally relevant in this proceeding.

1:33:38In other words, this may sound harsh, but we are permitted to demolish this mall with or without the CCMP.

1:33:46No design guideline applies to demolition.

1:33:51Not a single design guideline is a legally permitted approval criteria for a demolition permit.

1:33:58Instead, the city regulates demolition under Title 24 as part of the building regulations.

1:34:04There, the city specifically lists the objective standards for demolition.

1:34:09Those include a demolition plan, protection of utilities, erosion control, site safety both before and after demolition.

1:34:18These are the same demolition standards that applied to the city's own Central City Master Plan at the post office.

1:34:25The city has safely implemented these standards for buildings across the city, and Lloyd Mall will be no exception.

1:34:33The city does have special demo regulations for particular kinds of resources in town, including designated historic resources and residential use Lloyd Mall is not a designated historic resource and unfortunately now has no residential uses, so those rules would not apply.

1:34:52If the appellants are asking the City Council to force a property owner like the applicant here to keep a failing commercial mall open at continual and significant economic loss in order to secure their tenancies, that argument is fatally flawed also for several reasons.

1:35:09First, as we've said, there's no approval criteria that would authorize you to do that.

1:35:14But forcing the mall to remain open or requiring an ice rink would constitute a taking of private property for here private purposes, which are supposed to be public purposes.

1:35:25It does it for two reasons.

1:35:26One, there's an exaction analysis—the Dolan line of cases—which says you have to both prove that a condition of approval is directly related.

1:35:36To an applicable approval standard, which we don't have here, and that once you find that nexus, that reasonable relationship, you have to demonstrate that what you're asking of us is proportionate to our impact on the public.

1:35:51Here what we have is a significant amount of resources going to public infrastructure and again 6 acres of open space because that's what the City Council has declared as the public objective.

1:36:08In closing, this CCMP is voluntary.

1:36:12In 2018, the city mapped these areas within the central city that would be required to go through this process.

1:36:19It mapped 6 areas.

1:36:21Lloyd Center is not one of those areas.

1:36:23That means this applicant made this significant investment to engage in this process voluntarily.

1:36:29Councilmember Herbold.

1:36:31Right.

1:36:32And spend these kinds of resources?

1:36:37Well, why did they do it?

1:36:39We debated it, and the decision was to go for it as a partner of the city and to provide a long-term vision for this site, which includes a master public infrastructure plan, which then allows the city to understand the phasing and financing of public infrastructure.

1:36:58Thank you.

1:37:10Thank you, Mayor.

1:37:13Councilmember Herbold.

1:37:18Thank you, Mayor.

1:37:24Thank you.

1:37:25An urban design vision comes with the plan that establishes this new framework, like Nolan was telling you about, for parcel development and how these parcels interact with both the parcels within the master plan and outside.

1:37:38And then a comprehensive ped, bike, and vehicular circulation plan that fulfills the city's objectives for multimodal access.

1:37:45To respond to this significant voluntary investment, with an appeal is very regrettable, but to uphold such an appeal would have a far worse impact on the city's present and future economic development efforts, particularly here where we didn't have to do it and we meet and exceed the approval criteria.

1:38:07In sum, the appeals ask the City Council to preserve the ice rink and retain the mall.

1:38:13The code simply doesn't provide the authority to do either.

1:38:17But the CCMP and the CX zoning allow an ice rink in this master plan area and on this site and on many similarly zoned sites throughout the city and metro area.

1:38:30We request that you deny this appeal and join us in celebrating this profoundly important investment in our city.

1:38:38Thank you, and we're happy to take any and all of your questions.

1:38:47Thank you very much.

1:38:48Um, before we dive into questions and then move into testimony, I'm going to give us a, uh, restroom break.

1:38:55So it is currently 3:35, folks.

1:38:58If we could please be back at 3:45, and we will get into the queue from there.

1:39:01Thank you.

1:39:02Thank you, Mayor.

1:52:14And we're back.

1:52:15Thank you, everybody, for your patience as we acknowledge the fact that we are all human beings.

1:52:20Um, we are now at the point where, uh, just verifying, uh, is that the conclusion of your full presentation?

1:52:28Yes.

1:52:29It is.

1:52:30Okay, so we are going to take technical clarifying questions after public testimony.

1:52:33So thank you all very much for the presentation, and we're going to move now swiftly into public testimony.

1:52:39Thank you.

1:52:39For the applicant, our first testifier is Craig Stroud.

1:53:05Council President Dunphy and members of the Portland City Council, for the record, my name is Craig Stroud.

1:53:08I'm Metro's General Manager of Visitor Venues.

1:53:11I'm here today on behalf of Metro to express our support for the Lloyd Center Redevelopment Plan.

1:53:17This proposal addresses several major challenges Portland and our regional partners are working to solve.

1:53:22Metro's support centers on 2 areas.

1:53:24The first is housing, and the second is the success of our venue districts, including Lloyd and the Convention Center.

1:53:32On the housing front, we are in a housing crisis, and we need more housing, housing that people of all incomes can afford.

1:53:39We need dense housing near transit, jobs, and green spaces, walkable, bikeable neighborhoods where people want to live.

1:53:47To build quickly, we need sites like this one, Already connected to infrastructure and ready for redevelopment.

1:53:53Through Metro's state-mandated housing production strategy, we've aligned around a simple principle: when a project follows the rules and receives the required approvals, it should be allowed to move forward.

1:54:05That expectation applies across the region, including here in the Central City.

1:54:10On the venue support front, the Lloyd District has long been a key destination but it has struggled to remain vibrant.

1:54:17Each year, more than 2 million people visit the Oregon Convention Center and the Moda Center, yet we consistently hear from visitors that there are limited nearby options, especially in the evening.

1:54:27Redevelopment of the Lloyd Center represents a major opportunity to bring activity, amenities, and energy back to this district.

1:54:35We also recognize the importance of the ice rink as a community asset.

1:54:38Metro is continuing to explore long-term possibilities in this front, In closing, Metro is deeply invested in the success of the Lloyd District as a neighbor, as a venues operator, and as a partner in advancing housing.

1:54:53We urge the council to follow your established process and uphold the Lloyd Center redevelopment plan.

1:54:59Thank you for your time.

1:55:00Thank you, Craig.

1:55:03Okay, apologies.

1:55:04Next up we have Thomas Lauderdale.

1:55:07Fisher, Jameson, Joel Bravo, and Bill Scott.

1:55:14Thomas is online.

1:55:15You can unmute and go ahead.

1:55:18Can you hear me?

1:55:19We can.

1:55:20Oh, amazing.

1:55:21Okay.

1:55:21Hi, I'm Thomas Lauderdale.

1:55:22I have the band Pink Martini for the last 32 years.

1:55:24I live in downtown Portland.

1:55:26In 1982, my family moved here.

1:55:27I lived at 1250 Tillamook, 3 blocks north of Lloyd Center, and my parents currently live at Holiday Park Plaza.

1:55:33So here's an opportunity to replace a failing empty property, 30 acres in all, with a dense neighborhood that brings people, housing, businesses, and energy back to the inner city.

1:55:415,100 Housing units, a mix of both affordable and market-rate housing, will be built.

1:55:46Storefronts, restaurants, offices, 6 acres of courtyards, plazas, and a 2.3-acre central urban park.

1:55:53Monkee Presents is currently building a 4,000-seat music venue where Nordstrom used to be.

1:55:59The current stewards voluntarily gave many local small businesses hugely reduced rents during the last couple of years.

1:56:05This is a very generous temporary opportunity, and everybody understood that.

1:56:08But now, instead of being thankful, a few of these businesses now feel entitled and have the nerve to expect to be permanently subsidized.

1:56:14It's unbelievable.

1:56:15In regards to the ice rink, I too have a great amount of nostalgia for its past glory, but nostalgia doesn't pay the bills.

1:56:21A year-round ice rink would have to be run either by the City of Portland or a private entity.

1:56:25The City of Portland owns an ice rink, uh, 20 blocks away at the Veterans Memorial Coliseum, which it chooses not to open to the public.

1:56:29Councilor Smith.

1:56:32The city won't open its own ice rink.

1:56:34The city cannot mandate orders to a private company to keep this ice skating rink open.

1:56:38Also, it wouldn't be legal.

1:56:40This master plan isn't a City of Portland project.

1:56:42It's a private endeavor.

1:56:46Portland can't keep saying that it wants recovery, housing, investment, and vibrant neighborhoods while fighting every project that tries to deliver those things.

1:56:52I love Floyd Center, but it's time to move forward.

1:56:56Thank you very much.

1:56:58Fisher, you can go ahead online.

1:57:02Uh, thank you, President Dunphy, members of the council.

1:57:04My name is Fisher Jemison, and I'm testifying today in favor of the redevelopment.

1:57:09I grew up in Sabin, so I have a long history with this mall.

1:57:12I used to do my Christmas shopping there.

1:57:14I have been to my share of Lloyd Ait movies, and I can confidently say that the mall has been dead for a long time.

1:57:20I was excited to go back last year when I heard it was going through some kind of renaissance But not only did I leave empty-handed from that trip, I was also kind of unpleasantly surprised by how empty it still was, even with the cheap rent.

1:57:32When I think about the stakes of delaying the redevelopment, the other Northeast Portland landmark that comes to mind is Gordon's Fireplace Shop.

1:57:39When Gordon's closed, I remember the optimism about the potential to reuse the space, and I also remember how historic preservation rules turned it into an empty husk that is literally falling apart onto people walking below.

1:57:51Councilmember Dan Ryan.

1:57:51I'm particularly frustrated that I keep hearing people say things that just aren't true about this redevelopment.

1:57:58Replacing parking lots with transit-oriented development is not bad for the environment.

1:58:03There isn't a viable alternative plan that's just ready to go, and this is an extremely normal master plan of development, just like the Broadway Corridor or the Conway Plan.

1:58:12We also know from dozens of other stalled housing developments in this city that the kind of delay and obstruction the appellants are asking for doesn't work.

1:58:18Thank you.

1:58:19It just kills projects.

1:58:21This redevelopment matters too much to take that risk, so I hope you'll vote today to uphold the Design Commission's decision.

1:58:26Thank you.

1:58:28Thank you very much.

1:58:29Joel, go ahead online.

1:58:32Yes, thank you, President Dunphy, members of the City Council.

1:58:35For the record, my name is Joel Bravo, and I'm here today to testify in support for the Lloyd Sellon Master Plan.

1:58:41I'm a car-free renter, and I've been extremely fortunate to find a home that is affordable.

1:58:45In a neighborhood with easy access to jobs, shops, and recreations that don't require a car.

1:58:49Increasingly, and unfortunately though, that this is not attainable for more and more Portlanders due to the scarcity of our housing in desirable areas.

1:58:58The Lloyd Center Master Plan represents an opportunity to make a major investment in the people of Portland.

1:59:04The transformation of a slated-to-be-vacant mall and parking structures into thousands of homes, many of which will be affordable, Thanks.

1:59:10To the city's inclusionary zoning program, adjacent to shops, green spaces, and multiple transit lines, would create exactly the kind of thriving neighborhoods that benefit thousands.

1:59:20Property taxes from the development will fund further affordable housing and public goods.

1:59:24TriMet can accelerate its ridership recovery, and the city can meet its transit and climate goals by having thousands of people living in one of the most transit-rich areas of the city.

1:59:34And the small businesses of downtown and the Lloyd that give this city its heart and soul can benefit from having so many people living within an easy walk, bus, or train ride.

1:59:44Finally, the Lloyd Center is slated to be closed regardless of the decision made here today, and in the event that this master plan is rejected, the prospect of repurposing a closed mall for the benefit of all could be in jeopardy.

1:59:56You have an opportunity to make a generational investment in both the city and the people of Portland.

2:00:01I urge you to embrace that opportunity and approve the Lloyd Center master plan.

2:00:04Thank you.

2:00:06Thank you very much.

2:00:07Bill Scott, Yasmin Ibarra, Mary Avalon, Theron Schenk, David Binning.

2:00:22Welcome.

2:00:25Great.

2:00:26Uh, good afternoon.

2:00:27My name is Yasmin Ibarra.

2:00:28I'm the political director for SEIU Local 49.

2:00:32Our union represents 15,000 essential healthcare and property service workers in the city, including the subcontracted janitors, security, and laundry workers of the city.

2:00:43Our members have a long history of cleaning and securing buildings in Lloyd District.

2:00:48Their union jobs provide fair wages, affordable benefits that allow workers to support their families.

2:00:54But in recent years, they've watched their coworkers get laid off as Lloyd District District has struggled, leading to unprecedented vacancy and neighborhood decline.

2:01:03Portland needs bold investment, and the Lloyd Center Master Plan delivers it.

2:01:07The proposal would restore vibrancy in the Lloyd District, create more opportunities for workers who maintain and protect these spaces, and make Portland stronger for everyone.

2:01:16The Lloyd District was once an economic engine for this region, and it can be again.

2:01:21We urge you to appeal— to reject the appeal Thank you very much.

2:01:30Saren, go ahead online.

2:01:36Hi, my name is Saren Skank, and I live in Sullivan's Gulch, adjacent to Lloyd Center.

2:01:44My request is simple: please deny these appeals and uphold the Design Commission's approval.

2:01:50Unanimous appeal approval of the Central City Lloyd Center master plan.

2:01:57Lloyd Center is one of Portland's most important redevelopment opportunities.

2:02:02For too long, it has separated surrounding neighborhoods rather than connecting them.

2:02:09This master plan would turn a transit-rich, regionally connected site into a more open.

2:02:15Walkable, and integrated urban district.

2:02:19Public benefits are clear: better street connections, safer walking and biking, new open spaces, housing near accessible public transit, and renewed investment on this large Central Portland site.

2:02:34These are the kind of changes our neighborhood needs.

2:02:38I recognize that change brings real concerns Concerns, including the future of ice skating and the loss of familiar amenities.

2:02:46But those concerns should be addressed constructively, not by delaying a forward-looking land use plan.

2:02:53If the city is concerned about skating access, it should look seriously at Veterans Memorial Coliseum, the nearby city-owned rink, as a practical place to explore public access.

2:03:06These fields.

2:03:07Should not be used to stop or delay renewals.

2:03:12Thank you for your consideration.

2:03:15Thank you very much.

2:03:16David, go ahead online.

2:03:25David Binnig.

2:03:28Yep, you can go ahead.

2:03:29Can you hear me?

2:03:30We can.

2:03:31I apologize, I'm biking my kids to swim class right now.

2:03:41Oh, David, we lost your video, but you're— you can unmute.

2:03:46I'll go ahead and call more folks while we're working on David.

2:03:50Um, Bradley Robolino, Skyler Cruz, Robin Bogusiewicz, Madison Moskowitz, Robin, you can go ahead online.

2:04:09Hi everyone, my name is Robin Bogusiewicz and I'm testifying in support of redeveloping the Lloyd Center Mall.

2:04:14I lived in Portland my whole life and I currently live in Slabtown, which was a neighborhood also developed with a master plan.

2:04:19I want to preface this by saying there's clearly demand for a publicly accessible ice rink and lower rent for small businesses.

2:04:25These are both things that are good and things that Portland should have.

2:04:28However, I question if keeping Lloyd Center as it is will live up to the community's expectations.

2:04:33Over the last few years, Lloyd has become a center for small business.

2:04:36Why?

2:04:37Well, the building is getting torn down, so rents were lowered.

2:04:40The instant this building has to stand up on its own financially, someone has to pay for upkeep and energy costs of 18 city blocks of abandoned parking and empty anchor stores.

2:04:48Rents will go back up and Lloyd will return to its previous mostly empty state.

2:04:53While the Lloyd is directly next to mass transit, the vast amount of parking available induces drive-throughs.

2:04:58Additionally, the size of Lloyd cuts off neighborhoods from the north from being accessible by public transit.

2:05:03I've personally had medical appointments for gender-affirming care located to the north of Lloyd Center late at night after the mall's closure, where the only way I can access them is to take the MAX and walk around the perimeter of the entire mall.

2:05:16I don't know if any of you have spent much time on the outskirts of the Lloyd Center at night, but it's generally not a very pedestrian-accessible area.

2:05:22This area is ripe for dense development.

2:05:27Thank you very much.

2:05:44Madison, go ahead online.

2:05:47Thank you, Council President Dunphy.

2:05:49Councilors, my name is Madison Moskowitz, and I'm testifying on behalf of REACH Community Development.

2:05:54In support of the applicants for the Lloyd Center Master Plan.

2:05:56I'm a born and raised Portlander and current resident of D2, less than a mile from Lloyd.

2:06:02I think we all agree that we believe in Portland's future, but denying the master plan would tie us to the past and deny Portlanders dynamic growth, new third spaces, and more affordable homes.

2:06:12I grew up taking ice skating lessons at Lloyd.

2:06:14I shopped for middle school dance dresses, and I have shopped at Lloyd this year.

2:06:19I share I share so many folks' nostalgia about what Lloyd meant then and means now, but it's 27 acres at one of the best-served transit sites in our whole state that is thousands of unused parking stalls, a concrete heat sink, and a mostly vacant building.

2:06:33And better things are possible.

2:06:36If you deny the— or if you approve the appeals today, you're denying a community benefit plan that ensures Lloyd can hold more housing.

2:06:43And I think it's important to consider the perspectives of folks who aren't able to testify on this matter today, the future residents who will benefit from living in green, sustainable, dense neighborhoods within Lloyd.

2:06:55And I think it's important to consider their perspective even though they may not be testifying here today.

2:07:01For existing small businesses at Lloyd, REACH has a commercial space for rent on MLK and San Rafael Street in Northeast, less than a mile away, that we're trying to rent.

2:07:11And I'd be eager to talk to folks Thank you, Councilor.

2:07:24Thank you very much.

2:07:25David Binnig.

2:07:28Thank you.

2:07:29You can go ahead.

2:07:31Thank you, I appreciate it.

2:07:32Sorry about the confusion.

2:07:34Uh, thank you, councilors.

2:07:35I know everyone who's been here today wants the best for this project, so thanks to, to all of you today and yesterday too.

2:07:41I wanted to speak just to one specific point.

2:07:43The appeal from the Save Lloyd campaign says we should weigh the, says, embodied carbon of the existing mall in determining whether to preserve it.

2:07:51Some of you, I think certainly Councilor Green, should recognize that as a version of the sunk cost fallacy.

2:07:56That's, for example, your car keeps breaking down, you decide you need to keep fixing it because you already spent so much on the last repair.

2:08:03Um, it's definitely true that large concrete structures like Lloyd Center Mall involved a lot of carbon emissions to produce them.

2:08:10But those emissions that went into building, modifying, remodeling the existing White Center happened years, decades ago.

2:08:18We can't unmake them.

2:08:19We can't redeem them by anything we do now.

2:08:21So our current choices, including choices about emissions, about climate, have to be made looking forward, comparing future scenarios.

2:08:29Um, as folks have talked a lot about, we could try to put this on a path to thousands of homes a block away from the MAX station.

2:08:37Um, we could decide to maintain structured parking, uh, parking spaces there.

2:08:42But either way, we need to do an analysis of future impacts, both on construction and transportation.

2:08:48Whether the original structure was made of concrete or glass or bamboo doesn't have any relevance to those forward-looking decisions.

2:08:55This is important for reasons that go beyond Lloyd Center.

2:08:57Nolan earlier mentioned Harbor Drive I think of other concrete structures I'd like to see removed from Portland— the Martin Bridge, I-5 on the Inner East Side— and the idea that we need to preserve them permanently because of the cost of producing them would be a mistake there as here.

2:09:12Thank you so much.

2:09:14Thank you very much.

2:09:16Samuel Freeman Stiller, Sean Gillen, Mike Quinn, Cassidy Bolger, Joel Stenberg, Welcome.

2:09:39Hey, thanks for having me.

2:09:41Um, good afternoon, Council.

2:09:43My name is Joel Stenberg.

2:09:45Thanks for taking the time to carry out this process, for listening, for engaging with the community, and for your commitment to making our city better.

2:09:54And specifically today, making our Lloyd neighborhood better.

2:09:58I'm a small business owner in Lloyd.

2:10:01We opened our first coffee shop in 2019.

2:10:04My wife and I have invested our time, our energy, and a great deal of hope in the neighborhood.

2:10:11We chose to build our business here because we believed in what Lloyd was and what Lloyd could become.

2:10:18As many— some might know, owning a small business is incredibly rewarding.

2:10:21Thank you.

2:10:22But it's also very difficult.

2:10:24Every day is a balancing act— employee management, cost analysis, keeping prices affordable for our customers, and doing everything possible to create a welcoming place where people want to gather.

2:10:36Personally, I think we're doing a pretty good job at that, but the one thing we simply can't create on our own— and I wish, I wish, I wish I could— is creating foot traffic that every neighborhood business depends on.

2:10:49For years now, Lloyd has struggled with long stretches of inactivity and far fewer people on the streets than a neighborhood like this should have.

2:10:56Even the strongest businesses can't thrive without an active neighborhood.

2:11:00What gives me confidence in this master plan is that it wasn't rushed.

2:11:04It was shaped through a thoughtful, deliberate process with countless opportunities for neighbors, business owners like myself, and community members to participate, ask questions, and help shape the future of Lloyd.

2:11:14Shape the outcome.

2:11:15For those of us whose livelihood depends on the people walking through our doors, we need, um, Lloyd, to simply not— unsustainable.

2:11:23We need a new path forward, and I believe this master plan is that path.

2:11:27Thank you.

2:11:30Samuel, go ahead online.

2:11:33Thank you.

2:11:40Samuel, we've lost your audio.

2:11:43You can go ahead.

2:11:45We can hear you now.

2:11:46Okay, sweet.

2:11:47Thank you so much.

2:11:48Yeah, my name is Samuel Freeman.

2:11:50I am a construction industry professional, and I am here also in support of the applicant.

2:11:57Just with the Lloyd Center itself being demolished and also with the new builds going on is just the right path forward.

2:12:04There is so much good housing, so many good union jobs that can go on.

2:12:08And that will just lead not only the lives of the people doing the jobs there, union jobs that pay well, but also additionally the people who do get to live there later on as well.

2:12:18So making Union Base can be surrounded around there, the distance to the MAX stations, it will bring in so many other people, youth, over to the Portland area.

2:12:28And this is the optimal path forward that I see.

2:12:33And I have no use for the rest of my time.

2:12:35Thank you so much for you guys' time.

2:12:38Mike Quinn, go ahead online.

2:12:45Hello, Council President Dunphy and council members.

2:12:47My name is Mike Quinn, owner of Monty Presents Concert Company, serving Portland and the Northwest since 1983.

2:12:55We have partnered with AEG Concerts to develop a new 4,000-capacity music venue on the site of the former Nordstrom building at Lower Eastside Boulevard and 1st Avenue.

2:13:02Thank you, Councilor Herbold.

2:13:04Thank you, Mayor Wilson.

2:13:04I'm Councilor Mitch Green, and I'm here to speak in support of the Lloyd Center.

2:13:04We're investing in the future of this site because we believe in the vision that Urban Renaissance Group has put forward.

2:13:11When we evaluated opportunities for a new music venue, we looked for a location with a future.

2:13:17The Lloyd Center master plan provided that confidence.

2:13:20It shows a clear vision for transforming an aging mall into a vibrant mixed-use neighborhood with housing, 6 city blocks of public space, retail entertainment, and activity throughout the day and evening.

2:13:34That vision is a major reason we chose to invest there.

2:13:39The music venue represents just one piece of that future vision, and we feel works best as a part of a larger neighborhood transformation.

2:13:48We have been impressed working with Tom Kilbane and his group.

2:13:51They are dedicated, serious, and experts at just this type of urban transformation.

2:13:57The Lloyd District in Portland will be better off and smart to let URG invest in Portland and do their thing at Lloyd Center.

2:14:05As a Portland native and Irvington resident, I implore you to uphold the Design Commission's comprehensive unanimous approval and allow this important work to move forward.

2:14:16Portland needs this.

2:14:17Thank you.

2:14:19Thank you very much.

2:14:21Mike Cassidy, go ahead on line Hello, Council.

2:14:25Thank you for having me.

2:14:26My name is Cassidy Bolger.

2:14:28I am the board president of Oregon Smart Growth.

2:14:31I'm a District 2 resident, and I spent 4 years working in the Lloyd on multifamily housing in the district.

2:14:37During that time, I was a member of the Lloyd Community Association and spent over 2 years as the land use chair, so I'm very familiar and committed to the success of the Lloyd.

2:14:46The Lloyd Center site represents a once-in-a-generation Thank you.

2:14:48This is a once-in-a-generation opportunity to correct a major mistake in urban fabric that you've heard about today.

2:14:53The inward-facing superblock design of the mall interrupted Portland's historic street grid and prevented this part of the city from developing into one of the true urban dense neighborhoods that we love and have throughout the rest of the city.

2:15:06Instead, it became an automobile-oriented retail destination that was built for another era.

2:15:11That model has failed.

2:15:13The mall is nearly empty.

2:15:13The property is already vacant, empty, and no longer economically viable and scheduled to close regardless of what happens with this appeal.

2:15:19The City of Portland has already made the necessary public investments for success in this neighborhood.

2:15:25We have built the MAX system.

2:15:27We have built the streetcar, the bike infrastructure, the convention center, hotels, and entertainment destinations.

2:15:34The foundation for an amazing neighborhood is already in place.

2:15:39The current owner The owners are now prepared to make the private investment necessary at their own risk to transform this site and make it possible to deliver the housing and economic activity Portland desperately needs.

2:15:51We must begin this work.

2:15:52We must allow it to move forward for the benefit of the entire city.

2:15:56I respectfully ask you to deny the appeal.

2:15:59Thank you.

2:16:00Thank you very much.

2:16:02Steve Cole, Wade Rogers, Next up on the list of speakers, Bruce Wood, Emily Mandic, Ziggy Lopesinski.

2:16:13Steve, you can go ahead online.

2:16:16Thanks.

2:16:17Hi, my name is Stephen Cole, and I'm president of the Irvington Community Association.

2:16:21The ICA supports the master plan of Lloyd Mall parcels.

2:16:24Currently, the mall sits largely empty while taking up a considerable portion of land in an area which is already well served by mass transit.

2:16:31It is acting as an Thank you, Mayor.

2:16:32Thank you, Mayor.

2:16:32The mall has been an economic drag on the Broadway-Weidler business corridor and the blocks between the mall and the corridor.

2:16:36Those blocks have been losing businesses and are at the lowest point I have seen them in 22 years I've lived here.

2:16:41The ICA believes that the redevelopment will add much-needed housing while increasing density, adding public space, which is lacking in this quadrant of the city, as well as additional retail and entertainment, which will act as a catalyst to revitalize the aforementioned underperforming adjacent blocks and business corridor.

2:16:58We believe a reinvigorated Lloyd area could help turn this section of Portland into a city gem, a tourist destination.

2:17:04Given the council's rhetoric about the need for housing and some of the draconian measures which are being proposed, it would certainly be incongruent to reject this master plan which will add the needed housing.

2:17:13While we would like to see some north-facing retail in the new buildings, that's an issue which can be addressed later as new buildings are submitted for review.

2:17:20In regard to the concern about the land sitting next The ICA would certainly prefer to see development occur sooner rather than later.

2:17:28However, again, that's an issue which is separate from the approval of the design master plan as currently presented.

2:17:32Thanks.

2:17:34Thank you very much.

2:17:36Wade Rogers, go ahead online.

2:17:39Thank you.

2:17:41Uh, good morning, Council, or good afternoon now.

2:17:44Um, Council President Dunphy, Vice President Clark, and the members of the Council, uh, for the record, my My name is Wade Rogers, and I'm an analyst with Stockbridge Capital Group.

2:17:53Stockbridge is a real estate investment firm with deep ties to the Portland real estate market.

2:17:58We are the owners of Lloyd Retail Center, directly connected to the Lloyd Mall.

2:18:03I'm here today to voice Stockbridge's support for the Design Commission's unanimous approval of the Lloyd Center Master Plan and to urge the council to reject these appeals.

2:18:13This project is exactly what Portland should be encouraging.

2:18:16The Lloyd Center Master Plan is the product of years of work with neighbors, stakeholders, city staff, and a design commission.

2:18:24It turns an obsolete mall into a real neighborhood with housing, open space retail, and gathering places that will serve the city for generations.

2:18:32Today's hearing is about more than one project.

2:18:35It's about whether people who want to build housing in Portland can trust the city in the process.

2:18:39When an applicant follows the rules, does the outreach, and gets unanimous approval from the city's own decision-makers, Bankers, that should mean something.

2:18:46The Lloyd Center Master Plan is an incredible opportunity to bring new life to a critical part of the central city.

2:18:53Approving it sends a clear message that Portland welcomes thoughtful investment and is serious about building vibrant urban neighborhoods.

2:18:59I respectfully ask you to reject the appeal and support the future of Lloyd Center.

2:19:03Thank you.

2:19:04You can go ahead at the testimony table.

2:19:10My name is Bruce Wood.

2:19:11I have 38 years of experience developing commercial real estate in this area.

2:19:16I am currently leading 3 projects under construction in Cleveland, Ohio, with a combined cost of more than $400 million.

2:19:24I am also one of the owners of the Mountain View Ice Arena.

2:19:27Since purchasing the rink in 2006, I have remained committed to keeping it open and supporting ice sports in this region.

2:19:34To Despite strong support from the figure skaters, the hockey players, the coaches, and the public, we struggle each year to break even.

2:19:43Even with a cost basis that is a fraction of other facilities in the region, private ice facilities, including those owned by even NHL teams, require public funding or subsidies to remain financially viable.

2:19:58Real estate projects are complex and carry significant risk.

2:20:02Developers have many There are many reasons to abandon a project and pursue opportunities with fewer obstacles, greater certainty, and stronger appeal to capital.

2:20:12While every project begins with a vision, determining how it will be built, who will use it, and what it will cost requires millions of dollars, thousands of hours, and dozens of consultants.

2:20:22If costs are too high or conditions too restrictive, the project will not move forward.

2:20:28The Lloyd Center redevelopment Will require tons of cap— millions of dollars of capital.

2:20:33Capital, like water, follows the path of least resistance.

2:20:38In recent years, Detroit and Cleveland have attracted billions of dollars in downtown investment.

2:20:44In Cleveland, for example, my most recent project, we submitted the initial concept in June, we filed construction drawings in August, and we broke ground in October.

2:20:56Thank you.

2:20:575 Months from, from concept to where we broke ground.

2:21:02That's Portland's competition for capital.

2:21:07Thank you very much.

2:21:09Emily, go ahead online.

2:21:13Good afternoon, Council President Dunphy and members of council.

2:21:16For the record, my name is Emily Mandic and I'm the Vice President and Regional Manager with American Assets We own and operate 14 city blocks with a mix of Class A office, retail, and multifamily in Lloyd.

2:21:30I'm here to ask you to reject this appeal and uphold the Design Commission's unanimous approval of the Lloyd Center master plan.

2:21:37From a personal note, I grew up in a neighborhood adjacent to Lloyd and still live in that same neighborhood.

2:21:43Lloyd Center was a part of my childhood.

2:21:45I took ice skating lessons there.

2:21:47I I spent countless weekends roaming the mall in middle school.

2:21:51My first job was there and multiple ones thereafter.

2:21:54My mom worked in Waite Center Tower where the connecting skybridge was to the mall.

2:21:58The memories are endless.

2:22:00So I don't say this lightly, but Waite Center has exceeded its useful life and did so several years ago.

2:22:07It's time for a new beginning.

2:22:09I also come before you as someone who works in commercial real estate, developing Development does not happen without certainty.

2:22:15It depends on a clear, reliable process where someone applying for a permit or design review knows the rules, can trust that approval actually means something.

2:22:25If a project can do all of that and still face delays or conditions that go beyond approval criteria, as URG has experienced, it sends an alarming message to any investor in Portland.

2:22:37The opportunities this project brings Thank you very much.

2:22:59Ziggy, go ahead online.

2:23:02Yes, hello, my name's, uh, Sigmund Lopaczynski.

2:23:04I go by Ziggy.

2:23:05I'm the general manager of Crowne Plaza, Portland, Oregon.

2:23:08For, uh, over 22 years I've worked in the Lloyd District and currently, or just past president board of the Lloyd Community Association.

2:23:17Um, I urge you to reject these appeals, uphold the Design Commission's unanimous approval of the Lloyd Master Plan.

2:23:27The Lloyd Center, one of the most important, is the Lloyd area, is one of the most important, important urban districts.

2:23:34We're home to major employers, several hotels, the Oregon Convention Center, and excellent transit service.

2:23:41Yet over the past 2 decades, I have watched the neighborhood struggle.

2:23:45We have seen more vacancies, more empty lots, and fewer reasons for people to spend time in the neighborhood.

2:23:53At the center of our neighborhood sits a mall that is nearly empty.

2:23:57No longer economically viable and scheduled to close later this summer.

2:24:03The question before the council is not whether the site will change, it is whether we move forward with a thoughtful, community-supported plan that helps turn this neighborhood around.

2:24:13The Lloyd Community Association supports this master plan because it reflects years of planning, public engagement, and collaboration with the neighborhood associations like ours.

2:24:22Thank you.

2:24:22As someone who works in the hospitality industry, I know how important vibrant neighborhoods are to attract visitors who then support local businesses.

2:24:32Lloyd needs a catalytic project, and this is exactly— the master plan creates this kind of activity, investment, and sense of place that will bring people back into the heart of our city, creating the momentum our city needs.

2:24:47Portland needs more housing Thank you so much for being here.

2:24:55Sorry.

2:24:56Thank you very much.

2:24:59Anselm Fusco, Kristen Lieber, Julie Gustafson, Sam Rodriguez, David Weston, Owen Roncelli.

2:25:12Welcome, folks, and whoever Anyone wants to go first, please feel free.

2:25:22Check.

2:25:23President Dunphy, Vice President Clark, Council, thank you.

2:25:26My name is Anselm Fusco.

2:25:28I am— I've met some of you in my context as a board member of Oregon Smart Growth.

2:25:34I build multifamily apartment buildings here in Portland, and in the context of today's conversation, Most importantly, I live at 24th and Knott, and Lloyd Center is in my neighborhood.

2:25:46I'm here to ask that you reject the appeals in front of you and allow the project to move forward, allow the master plan to move forward.

2:25:56I don't have time to talk about all the reasons I'm confident the master plan will make this my neighborhood better.

2:26:02I also don't have time to talk about how cities around the country are working very hard and changing their rules and their procedures to make it more difficult for NIMBYism and groups with special interests to exercise the heckler's veto.

2:26:17We're not going to talk about those things.

2:26:19What I am going to do is talk about the fact that all you have to do is look at Washington right now— in Washington, D.C., not state— and see what happens when expertise, experience, and careful consideration are replaced by political considerations.

2:26:35I think that's a good point.

2:26:39I am urging you to take into full account and not second-guess the thousands of hours put in by staff and the unanimous approval by the Design Commission.

2:26:52And I'm urging you not to signal to the people who live and work here, to the people who are thinking about moving here, to the people who are thinking about investing here, that we are not listening.

2:27:01Thank you.

2:27:01Thank you very much.

2:27:16Good afternoon, Council President Dunphy, Vice President Clark, and members of council.

2:27:20My name is Julie Gustafson, and I'm the treasurer of the Northeast Broadway Business Association, which represents small businesses along locally owned businesses along Northeast Broadway and Widler.

2:27:31I am also president of a homeowners association representing 86 units and some commercial space on Northeast Broadway, just 4 blocks from the mall in the site in question.

2:27:40I have a lifelong connection with this mall.

2:27:42I grew up in the neighborhood.

2:27:44I remember the open-air days.

2:27:45I remember the thriving '90s, and I am personally very excited to see this next phase in my neighborhood that I love.

2:27:54NEBA supports this project because our district needs investment activity and new customers.

2:28:00For years, the Lloyd District and surrounding commercial corridors have experienced declining foot traffic and prolonged vacancies.

2:28:07The Lloyd Center Master Plan creates an opportunity to reverse that trend.

2:28:11It will bring new housing, new residents, and new economic activity to one of the most transit-accessible locations in the city.

2:28:18For small businesses, foot traffic matters.

2:28:20For residents, connectivity matters.

2:28:24Reconnecting the street grid through the Lloyd Center property will allow pedestrians to move more easily between neighboring commercial corridors such as Broadway and Weidler.

2:28:31We now have an opportunity to reverse the cycle of decline in our area while creating a more connected, walkable community.

2:28:38Portland desperately needs stronger commercial corridors and more housing in the central city.

2:28:43This redevelopment project While we recognize the concerns by those affected by the mall's closure, we cannot let them stand in the way of a redevelopment project that will benefit the broader community.

2:28:53For these reasons, we respectfully ask you to affirm the Design Commission's decision.

2:28:58Thank you.

2:28:59Thank you very much.

2:29:02Good afternoon, uh, President Dunphy and Council.

2:29:05My name is Sam Rodriguez.

2:29:06I'm a senior managing director with Mill Creek Residential, where I multifamily residential developer in town.

2:29:12But until recently, for 8 years, I was a member of the Portland Design Review Commission.

2:29:18During my time on the commission, I, I, I, as part of the commission, reviewed and voted on numerous master plans and major development proposals throughout the city.

2:29:27I understand the rigor and the design pro— of the design review process, the level of analysis involved, the responsibility commissioners have to apply the city's regulations thoughtfully and consistently, consistently been important.

2:29:40Lloyd Center Master Plan received unanimous approval from the Design Review Commission.

2:29:44That is significant.

2:29:46The commission is composed of volunteer professionals with expertise in architecture, urban design, planning, landscaping, architecture, and development that you approve, that you've vetted.

2:29:57These are individuals appointed to provide the city with independent technical expertise and to ensure that projects meet Portland's design and planning objectives.

2:30:05After a thorough design— thorough review, the commission unanimously concluding that this master plan satisfies these objectives.

2:30:14While reasonable people may disagree on aspects of any project, overturning a unanimous approval by the city's designated body of experts should not be taken lightly.

2:30:26I would also encourage you to consider the broader message of supporting this appeal, of that supporting this appeal would send to the investment and development community.

2:30:35Portland is already competing for scarce investment capital.

2:30:40Ran out of time, but you get the gist.

2:30:42Please don't overturn this appeal.

2:30:45Thank you.

2:30:46Thank you very much.

2:30:48Kristen, go ahead online.

2:30:52Hi, Council.

2:30:53My name is Kristen Leiber.

2:30:55I'm the executive director of Lloyd Eco District.

2:30:58We are a nonprofit with a 15-year history in Lloyd.

2:31:01We're located inside of Lloyd Center right now, and we spend 100% of our time caring and advocating for people and space in this 1 square mile.

2:31:10We love the mall.

2:31:10We love the affordable rents and the creative use and the small businesses who we work side by side with.

2:31:16We've been grateful for our time there.

2:31:18For URG and Lloyd Center's partnership and for support of the neighborhood and for the cheap rent on borrowed time that was communicated well.

2:31:26But borrowed time is not a plan.

2:31:28Our work is in sustainability, and we take a very big view of that word.

2:31:32We ask what will help Lloyd become a healthier, better neighborhood for future generations.

2:31:38And right now we see the harm this aging, car-heavy, largely underused building is causing us.

2:31:44We see the stagnation around it.

2:31:46We see how hard it is to make the neighborhood feel alive when the biggest building in the middle of it is not fully working.

2:31:52We support making this a better place for the people already here and welcoming thousands of new residents into our neighborhood that is close to everything and has excellent public transit.

2:32:02It should be the green transit-forward, walkable, livable neighborhood that we've worked toward.

2:32:07So the appellants are naming real values We've seen the joy the ice rink brings.

2:32:12We've seen the creativity that business incubation brings.

2:32:15I encourage the city and appellants to pursue those goals regardless of the future of Lloyd Center.

2:32:20They're worthy and they matter, but they— those public goods can't depend on private development.

2:32:27Please reject the appeals and help Lloyd step forward.

2:32:29Thank you.

2:32:30Thank you very much.

2:32:34David Weston, go ahead on the line.

2:32:36Thank you, Council President and members of council, for the opportunity to speak to you today.

2:32:43My name is David Westin.

2:32:43I'm the general manager of the DoubleTree by Hilton in the Lloyd District.

2:32:47Our hotel is located next door to Lloyd Center Mall and has been a fixture in the neighborhood since the 1960s, almost as long as the mall itself.

2:32:55The Lloyd District is home to the Oregon Convention Center and several hotels.

2:32:59Visitors from all over the world open their wallets in our city, bringing tremendous tax revenues.

2:33:03But at Lloyd Center, they see a nearly empty mall, a mall that is no longer economically viable, and a mall that is closing in just over a month.

2:33:12Economic vitality matters, so this neighborhood and this city can't afford to hold on to a decaying building.

2:33:18Coming to work every day in this neighborhood, I see the challenges we face, the business that's been lost in my hotel and around us, and how that adversely impacts our city's revenues.

2:33:27I worry about the 120 team members who work here and how they will get enough hours to support their families.

2:33:32These are real people whose livelihoods depend in large part on how well we as a city execute a vision for the future.

2:33:40So I'm optimistic about the Lloyd Center Mall redevelopment and all the value it will bring to our city and our neighborhood.

2:33:45Portland needs this redevelopment for housing, for open space, for tax revenues, and opportunities for Portlanders.

2:33:53I ask that you reject the appeals and affirm the Design Commission decisions.

2:33:56Thank you.

2:33:56Thank you very much.

2:34:01Owen, go ahead online.

2:34:06Good afternoon, members of City Council.

2:34:08My name is Owen Ron Kelly, and I'm executive director of Go Lloyd, a transportation management association based in the Lloyd neighborhood.

2:34:17At Go Lloyd, we promote economic vitality by working with employers and community partners To reduce reliance on single occupancy vehicles and support walking, biking, and transit.

2:34:28Our work helps make the Lloyd neighborhood more accessible, connected, and resilient.

2:34:33And I'm here today to ask you to deny this appeal and uphold the Design Commission's unanimous decision to approve the Lloyd Center master plan.

2:34:43Lloyd Center was built in a different era.

2:34:45Today it's nearly empty, no longer economically sustainable.

2:34:49And scheduled to close.

2:34:50The answer is not whether it will change; it's what comes next.

2:34:55This master plan transforms an underutilized superblock into a walkable, transit-oriented development with housing, jobs, and local businesses, and public gathering spaces.

2:35:06It builds on one of Lloyd's greatest strengths: its exceptional access to transit and active transportation infrastructure.

2:35:14This kind of project strengthens our local economy, supports business, and creates jobs, and brings new life and investment into a neighborhood.

2:35:23We ask you to affirm the Design Commission's decision, reject the appeal, and allow this project to move forward, because the future of Lloyd shouldn't be defined by what it used to be, but what it has the opportunity to become.

2:35:36Thank you for your— thank you for your time today.

2:35:39Thank you very much.

2:35:43Maxwell Flint, Keith Jones, Aaron Kefalu, Becky Hawkins, Mary Nolan, Langdon Herrick, Sarah Badiali.

2:35:59Maxwell, you can go ahead.

2:36:01Thank you.

2:36:02Um, in light of the situation, I know a 3rd option through Industrial development bonds.

2:36:08Lloyd Center can be saved because the city could, if they choose, buy Lloyd Center from them and finance it through the sale of industrial development bonds.

2:36:18One more thing, bringing Walmart into Lloyd Center would make Lloyd Center more profitable than anything they have planned.

2:36:26And I do thank you for that.

2:36:30Oh, thank you.

2:36:31Thank you very much.

2:36:46Sorry, uh, Keith Jones, you can go ahead online.

2:36:51Great, thank you.

2:36:52Uh, good afternoon, Council President Dunphy and councilors.

2:36:55My name is Keith Jones and I serve as the executive director of the Lloyd Enhance I'm here today in support of the Lloyd Center Master Plan and urge you to uphold the Design Commission's approval.

2:37:07For generations, Lloyd Center has been the heart of Lloyd District.

2:37:10Along with the Moda Center and Oregon Convention Center, it helped to define this neighborhood and brought millions of visitors to Lloyd.

2:37:17Since the pandemic, the mall has struggled, and while a small community of local businesses have taken root there, it no longer brings enough visitors to Lloyd District.

2:37:24Thank you.

2:37:25Thank you, Mayor.

2:37:25Thank you, Mayor.

2:37:25Thank you, Mayor.

2:37:25The Lloyd District has been struggling for many years to sustain the site.

2:37:26Lloyd Center, it now needs to be reimagined for the next generation.

2:37:31The Lloyd DSD has been working with Prosper Portland's Office of Small Business to help retain some of the small businesses that have taken root at Lloyd Center and keep them in the district.

2:37:39This master plan creates an opportunity not only for much-needed housing, but also for the attraction and retention of local businesses, restaurants, and neighborhood-serving retail.

2:37:49Visitors come to Lloyd every day for conventions, concerts, sporting events, and meetings.

2:37:55Yet there's still too few opportunities for them to experience the local businesses and character that makes Portland unique.

2:38:01This redevelopment can help change that.

2:38:04Having been a resident of the Lloyd District for more than 10 years, I've seen both the challenges and the tremendous potential of this neighborhood.

2:38:11That potential is one of the reasons I accepted this role at the ESD.

2:38:14The project represents an opportunity to help This project is crucial to the future of the neighborhood and the city of Portland.

2:38:31On behalf of Lloyd's Enhanced Service District, I respectfully urge you to uphold the Lloyd Center Master Plan.

2:38:37Thank you.

2:38:38Thank you very much.

2:38:39Aaron, go ahead online.

2:38:42Thank you, President Dunphy.

2:38:43Thank you, Mayor Dunphy.

2:38:43Thank you, Mayor Dunphy.

2:38:44Vice President Clark and members of the council, my name is Aaron Calfolo.

2:38:47I live in Sullivan's Gulch adjacent to Lloyd, and I also work in the Lloyd District.

2:38:52I walk, bike, and take transit through the neighborhood regularly, and I'm speaking today in support of upholding their approval of the master plan.

2:39:00When I look at Lloyd today, I don't see the highest and best use of the land.

2:39:04I see an aging inward-facing superblock surrounded by vast parking areas, but I also see one of Portland's greatest opportunities to create more homes, local businesses, and public spaces in one of the most transit-connected parts of our city.

2:39:16I feel very fortunate to live in this part of the city.

2:39:20I want Portland to remain a place where people like me can move to a new neighborhood, make friends, pursue creative interests, build careers, build a life.

2:39:30Giving people more housing opportunities in neighborhoods like Lloyd is part of making that possible.

2:39:35Today's hearing includes the voices of people who use Lloyd Center today.

2:39:39I— and yesterday's as well.

2:39:41I hope we also remember the people who could one day live here, work here, and become part of this community.

2:39:48Delaying or blocking this master plan also delays the opportunity for future Portlanders to enjoy the kind of neighborhood that I feel privileged to call home.

2:39:55Amen.

2:39:57I appreciate what Lloyd Center has meant to the city, but I see the master plan as a flexible framework that allows this neighborhood Thank you very much.

2:40:22Becky, go ahead online.

2:40:29No, there we go.

2:40:32Thanks.

2:40:33My name is Becky Hawkins.

2:40:34I moved to Portland 12 years ago because some of my fellow artists quipped that Portland was the last city in America where a cartoonist could buy a house.

2:40:43Even in 2012, that was no longer true.

2:40:46So I would just like to reiterate that I understand the need for low commercial rents and places where creative people can do creative things.

2:40:59I have worked in the nonprofit arts sector since I moved here, so I also understand that there are things that are very important and things that make Portland what it is that don't make a lot of money.

2:41:11And I think, you know, philosophically I'm very aligned with a lot of the people on the appellant side.

2:41:18I think we have It was interesting.

2:41:20I, you know, we heard hours and hours of, I think that dense housing is good, but we need the place for kids to go and we need a place for people to gather for free.

2:41:30And now I'm here saying, I understand that we need a place for kids to go and a place for people to gather, um, but we need dense housing.

2:41:39Um, I— my partner always says to think about, uh, what everybody's needs are and communicate from there.

2:41:46Um, so I would like everyone I would just encourage everyone to just sit with that.

2:41:50We need lower commercial rents because you aren't— you know, you can say that it'll be a vibrant neighborhood if there are lots of stores, but, um, you know, it— the people also make the place vibrant.

2:42:03So we do, uh, you know, we need low commercial rents.

2:42:06We need— you know, I think you got it.

2:42:08Thanks.

2:42:08Thank you very much.

2:42:13That concludes applicant testimony.

2:42:16Okay, so this concludes public testimony.

2:42:20Please note there will not be another opportunity to testify orally, and the written record is now closed.

2:42:26Um, colleagues, it is 4:38.

2:42:30We have a little bit of administrative business because we have to reschedule— we have to open and reschedule the recap time-certain item.

2:42:36Um, so I'm going to give us the next 12 minutes to be able to, uh, ask some of the questions of the applicant and the appellant, appellants.

2:42:44And we will be, however, for everybody in the room, we will not be making any decisions today.

2:42:49We will be having further council debate because obviously the full council is not currently right here.

2:42:55And we will be having further discussion of this on July 8th.

2:42:59So before we leave today.

2:43:00But in the interim, I wanted to let councilors ask a couple of clarifying questions.

2:43:05Mr. President, we need to also allow the appellants opportunity for rebuttal.

2:43:10Absolutely.

2:43:11Okay.

2:43:12And that part too.

2:43:12So we have a lot to do still, but I want to ask some technical clarifying questions, uh, from councilors.

2:43:18So I'll start with Councilor Smith.

2:43:20Is that all right?

2:43:20Thank you.

2:43:21Um, oh, or I think before we get to those questions, let's, um, conclude the order of the procedure from the hearing, allow rebuttal from both the parties, both the appellants And then we can do the questions.

2:43:32Sorry.

2:43:32This is a very prescribed process, and I appreciate everybody's patience with us on this.

2:43:37So then we will now move to the rebuttals from the appellants.

2:43:42And so just for, just for the record, so that it's clear that while we hear, the, the record is not closed.

2:43:49We're continuing the hearing.

2:43:50We're hearing from the parties, and then we'll get back to, uh, your earlier statement.

2:43:55Yeah, yeah.

2:43:57Undo what I said and only listen to Lauren.

2:43:59Thank you.

2:44:00We welcome up our appellants for 5 minutes each.

2:44:05Thank you.

2:44:06Jeff Kleinman for Save Lloyd Ice Coalition, and Jennifer Gilmore Robinson is with me on behalf of the coalition.

2:44:18In these 5 minutes, I want to hit some scattered points.

2:44:22And respond to certain issues that were raised.

2:44:27First of all, the preservation of the rink, as we have said, is in absolutely no way incompatible with the housing objectives here, which we do not oppose.

2:44:42And as the last witness, I believe yesterday, testified, he failed to testify as to his expertise.

2:44:47I think he was talking about the parking.

2:44:48But he's very familiar with engineering structures and the central portion of the mall, which covers the rink, can be saved and the rest of the mall can be redeveloped and serve all the purposes in question.

2:45:06Mr. Kilbane testified this afternoon that everybody should have known that there would be no preservation of the rink.

2:45:13And I would say, well, But for your repeated statements to them that it would be preserved, so we'll leave that at that.

2:45:29There have been statement legal statements made in writing and stated in so many words today as well that basically the desire.

2:45:40Yes.

2:45:40Do you believe that the Design Commission and this Council lack the jurisdiction to consider the issues raised by the appellants?

2:45:48And if that's the case, what the heck are we doing here?

2:45:52The fact of the matter is that there is a structure in the City Code for review of projects such as this.

2:46:00There are goals and policies and guidelines that must be considered.

2:46:07Then appellants have a right to proceed and ask the appropriate review bodies to make the appropriate decisions based on the criteria.

2:46:17With that in mind, although counsel for the applicant insisted that the guidelines are meaningless, I wanna point out that, first of all, we have separately asserted arguments on each of the grounds Under 5 mandatory goals and policies that are not guidelines.

2:46:37They're stated in our appeal document.

2:46:40And then you have the guidelines themselves, which must be successfully addressed whether they're mandatory or not.

2:46:48And that's just not happened in this case.

2:46:53In terms of the evidence that's been presented to you in the form of lovely graphics, Yes.

2:46:59And then the other topics about the project going forward, there is nothing mandatory about those.

2:47:06Those are just examples of what could happen.

2:47:10The market is very difficult, as we all know, for even filling affordable housing, much less market-rate housing here, and it may not recover for quite a while.

2:47:23You have a developer that holds 90% Not a developer, you have an investor, KKR, that holds 90% of the ownership of this project that picked up the site out of bankruptcy for 10% of fair market value.

2:47:42And they will get around to selling off pieces over the years as the market justifies purchases— Pardon me.

2:47:52Yes.

2:47:54This is going to be a 27-acre eyesore for years to come.

2:48:02And that's why the appropriate resources that are already there— we're not asking for new things, contrary to the River Place decision that has been described to you.

2:48:15These are existing uses which fall within the within your approval criteria.

2:48:19We're not saying you've gotta go, you know, make room for something.

2:48:23This is here.

2:48:25And we'd ask you to recognize that and to protect that.

2:48:31And it is something that is what the city needs.

2:48:36It's an attractant rather than the repellent that a 27-acre vacant lot would be in the center of the Lloyd District.

2:48:49So with respect to the music venue that's been discussed, that's not part of the master plan.

2:48:55That's already been approved on the Nordstrom site and that's terrific, but it's not a concern as to this case.

2:49:04It's going forward.

2:49:06It's just great.

2:49:08So So as I said, we have cited criteria that apply and must be applied, and they have not been.

2:49:18Thank you for your consideration.

2:49:19I guess we'll be having questions later, or if you want to ask them now.

2:49:25We will.

2:49:26We have a second appellant we have to also hear from, and then we will open it to questions.

2:49:31Thank you so much.

2:49:31In the last few minutes that we have here.

2:49:33You bet.

2:49:43Welcome back.

2:49:44Hello again.

2:49:45Thank you.

2:49:46We have some PDFs, a couple graphics.

2:49:53Um, there's, there's 1 and 2 PDFs, and if we could— yeah, so this— I'm Matt Henderson again.

2:50:01I'm with Save Lloyd Campaign.

2:50:04We just want to address some of the mischaracterizations about the Save Lloyd campaign movement.

2:50:11For one, we feel like there are all sorts of options for the site that involve keeping a meaningful portion of the mall intact.

2:50:24What is on the screen currently is the Urban Renaissance Group.

2:50:28Thank you.

2:50:28Councilor Herbold.

2:50:28This is the conceptual site plan originally presented.

2:50:31And I would point out that the yellow square in the middle is where, roughly where the ice rink is in the mall.

2:50:39And so it was very easy for me to look at this and imagine, oh, okay, so they are planning on maybe keeping the ice rink.

2:50:47I think it was very much implied, to say the least, At least that Tom Kilbane promised that, you know, we'd be keeping the historic ice rink.

2:51:02Could we go to— so, oh, about this.

2:51:04So the green space is essentially where the currently accessible part of the mall is.

2:51:10So the mall gets extracted, it's turned into the green space that's the required percentage, and then all the yellow developments are new developments.

2:51:19Okay.

2:51:20And those are the parcels that they're going to sell off as the market allows.

2:51:25Could we go to PDF number two?

2:51:30PDF number two is going to be our our attempts to envision two potential alternative plans that involve this adaptive reuse concept.

2:51:43The top one is.

2:51:46Where the currently accessible part of the mall is retained, and it actually includes a little bit more of a portion of it, which is the part towards Holiday Park because that's the Macy's building.

2:51:59And Macy's is currently not accessible to the public.

2:52:02It's a huge structure that could easily be cleared away and make room for more housing in addition to Sears and Marshalls, which are anchor tenant stores.

2:52:10Thank you.

2:52:11That could easily be to give way to new housing and mixed-use development, as well as some of the parking garages that Nolan Leinhardt pointed out do shroud the mall in this kind of concrete, you know, less appealing look from the exterior.

2:52:30Our point's pretty straightforward.

2:52:31It's that adaptive reuse is a concept that is widely embraced Yeah.

2:52:37It's been embraced the world over.

2:52:39It works.

2:52:40There's many great examples of it.

2:52:44Our group would be shocked to imagine that ZGF Architects, Nolan Leinhardt, and their team didn't first consider that very prospect.

2:52:55And them being a client of private equity out of New York, KKR, we have to imagine that, well, they're just looking to build up and generate just maximize the profit on this site.

2:53:08And our argument with the Save Lloyd campaign is there is some sort of middle ground to be met here.

2:53:15There is an alternative plan that clearly exists.

2:53:19This mall is very functional infrastructure.

2:53:22You heard from countless members of the public.

2:53:26You heard from the Icegate Coalition that this This still serves the community in immaculate ways.

2:53:34And why not figure out a way, as our elected representatives, to act as a convener about this?

2:53:44Like, what are your options here?

2:53:47You're going to fully empower the elites and power brokers of Portland, not to refer to them derogatorily, but It's a very clear distinction that we're witnessing.

2:54:00And you can completely ignore what the public has attested to, or you can take some form of action about this and encourage some way of finding some compromise here.

2:54:15Save Lloyd campaign has done a lot of outreach.

2:54:19We met with Metro, we met with some of our city council members.

2:54:21We wish we We had a lot of catch-up to do and a lot of bases to cover.

2:54:27But what we arrived at is we would love to see a public-private partnership of some kind.

2:54:35We would love to see Metro come on board as— even though Metro testified for the applicants today, none of this is set in stone.

2:54:46Their framework, it's a land use framework.

2:54:49Yes.

2:54:50They said themselves they're open to any possibilities, you know, of purchase and even a newly rebuilt ice rink.

2:54:59We're here saying there is a wonderful functional ice rink already there.

2:55:04There is a wonderful functioning complex that is an incredible conduit to holding this community in all sorts of different use cases that you all have heard from the public about.

2:55:17And that has to mean something.

2:55:20And I will also agree with Jeffrey Kleinman, Slick's lawyer, Save Lloyd Ice's lawyer, that this is part of the public process we are participating in, and we paid money for these appeals.

2:55:38So thank you for hearing them.

2:55:40I'm probably coming up on my time.

2:55:42Actually, 40 seconds over already.

2:55:44I'm so sorry, I didn't hear the bell.

2:55:46I really appreciate it.

2:55:47That's okay.

2:55:48Sorry.

2:55:48So, um, we'll look forward to— do we get to receive some questions from you?

2:55:53Did I hear that correctly?

2:55:54Councilors have some questions.

2:55:54Will primarily be on July 8th, but we're going to get a couple today.

2:55:57Thank you.

2:55:57Yeah, thank you.

2:56:04Okay, thank you.

2:56:06So, um, the appellants did run a little We're a little over.

2:56:10Do we— is that anything that we need to offer?

2:56:14Christy's nodding her head, so it sounds fine.

2:56:16I'm just checking to make sure they didn't object, but yeah, I think that that's okay.

2:56:20Perfect.

2:56:21Now I'm going to get into the queue to ask a couple of questions, but again, we'll get the bulk of our further council discussion on July 8th.

2:56:29But Councilor Smith?

2:56:30Yes, I did have a question of the appellant that was just giving the presentation.

2:56:40Thank you.

2:56:41Thank you for your comments.

2:56:42And I was looking at your renderings.

2:56:45Did those renderings go through any kind of design review at the city that you just put up?

2:56:51Mine?

2:56:53None whatsoever.

2:56:54Okay.

2:56:54Yeah, we just overlaid some of our simple concepts on top of URG's plans.

2:57:02And I would, would have liked to have pointed out that if you got rid of Marshalls and Sears and you hemmed in the east wing of the mall just a little bit, you could still achieve one of their celebrated new throughways to, you know, create a new road.

2:57:22I'm just trying to do apples to apples because they have a plan that went through design review.

2:57:28Yeah.

2:57:28Okay.

2:57:29So it is not apples to apples.

2:57:31We're not sure if that is possible, what you said that could be done.

2:57:38And thank you for your comments.

2:57:40And I want to talk to your lawyer.

2:57:42Did you all ever look to identify other spaces to have the ice rink?

2:57:51Because I didn't know we had an ice rink.

2:57:56So, Councilor, yes, actually we've had a multitude of conversations.

2:58:04Actually, we submitted that in our written materials that detail some of the entities that we've reached out to, including Veterans Memorial Coliseum.

2:58:13We've had conversations with both Winterhawks, who own the 2 ice rinks 17 miles away and 7 miles away, and then Mountain View, which is separate ownership.

2:58:24We've talked to folks at Metro Prosper Portland.

2:58:27We've talked to folks at the Expo Center about the possibility of an inter-rink, and all of those are included in our written.

2:58:34And I'm sorry, and I apologize for that, I didn't see that, but did you also include the Fred Meyer building?

2:58:40It's in my district, in District 1, in the The old Kohl's building out on 102nd and Gleason.

2:58:47Was that ever considered as well?

2:58:49So thank you for raising that question.

2:58:51We've been in discussions with Prosper Portland and they've identified some sites.

2:58:55I believe the site you're referring to is one that we actually, not me personally, but a member of our team spoke with about it just this morning about a possibility.

2:59:04So there are a few different potential options.

2:59:08That's one.

2:59:09Expo Center potentially.

2:59:11Yeah.

2:59:11Um, so, so we're absolutely exploring other options.

2:59:14And the process over 4 months of been trying to build that kind of momentum and connection and getting that assistance has been very, very slow.

2:59:23And we just actually passed a budget last week, and in that budget there's like $500,000 per entity for new businesses from Prosper Portland And so I just wanted to throw that out there to you because I didn't know if you knew about that.

2:59:41We just passed the budget, so I don't know if you've had that conversation with Prosper, but I wanted to tell you that because I, I too have fond memories of my earlier years at, at the Lloyd Center.

2:59:54And, and I get it and I understand, but I also want to make sure that we're, we're, um, we're paying attention to everything that's apples to apples.

3:00:05So, so thank you so much, um, for your comments.

3:00:08And I just have one question of Ben Nielsen from, um, from the applicant— not the applicant, but from our, um, PP&D department.

3:00:20Ben, there you are.

3:00:23Good afternoon, Councilor.

3:00:25I have a question because there was some conversation about the CCMP either requiring or not requiring the ice rink to stay where it is.

3:00:38So can you clarify that for me?

3:00:42So I think you're referring to the testimony that you heard today that said that there's no specific requirements in the CCMP approval criteria Correct.

3:00:56Yeah, that's not explicitly spelled out anywhere.

3:00:59I think where the appellants are tying their arguments are to interpretations of specific policies and to interpretations of guidelines that apply respectively to criteria H1 and H2.

3:01:14And is there a provision in, in the design that requires the applicant to have a specific applicant to actually identify a place, an ice rink for the ice— for the Save Lloyd Ice folks?

3:01:32There's no requirement in the approval criteria, and there is no specific plan proposed that identifies a location for an ice rink.

3:01:42Okay, that's what I needed to know.

3:01:43And I just have, Mr. President, I just have one question.

3:01:46Um, could the attorney for the applicant come up?

3:01:54Thank you so much for your comments.

3:01:56Um, is the owner planning to keep an ice rink in the new plans?

3:02:03Well, maybe I'm not the right person to answer that question, but I'll give it a shot.

3:02:07The, the— Tom Kilbane is here and can answer that question, but what I do know from representing him is that he fully intends to enter any negotiations freely and willingly with an ice skate operator who wants to locate in the Lloyd Center.

3:02:25It is an allowed use.

3:02:27It would be accommodated in the master plan, and we will enter those negotiations in good faith.

3:02:33The line that we're drawing is because the approval criteria cannot require us to do that we can't be mandated to actually include the rink.

3:02:43There's so many conversations that have to happen before then.

3:02:46And you noted that, well, someone on the other side about the music arena, it is not associated with your— No, it's on the block, but it's outside the master plan area.

3:02:58Okay, okay, perfect.

3:03:00It's on the corner of the larger Super Bowl.

3:03:03And so anything that you do, it has It has to kind of go in concert with what they're doing.

3:03:12Yes.

3:03:12So part of the design review that you were speaking to before was very rigorous with regards to what we're doing and what the context of the site already is.

3:03:21So when Monkee came through with the music venue and they had to respond to the balance of the site and we had to respond to them in terms of design.

3:03:30Okay, perfect.

3:03:31Perfect.

3:03:31Thank you so much.

3:03:32I appreciate your, your comments.

3:03:34I think we're at 4:59.

3:03:36Sure.

3:03:36I apologize for that, but I, I needed to get some clarification.

3:03:39Thank you all so much.

3:03:41And Councilor Kanal has one quick question, and then we're going to continue this item.

3:03:44So Councilor Kanal, go ahead.

3:03:45Sorry to everybody who's been waiting for us to talk about this.

3:03:47I know we don't have time.

3:03:48I have one of my several questions, and it's for Loren King.

3:03:51Legally, can we remand this item back to the Design Commission without making a decision on the appeals?

3:03:57The zoning code does not contemplate remanding to the Design Commission.

3:04:00That is not an option in the zoning code.

3:04:02Mr. President.

3:04:03Thank you very much.

3:04:04So this item will be carried over to a time certain on July 8th, 2026 at 10:00 AM.

3:04:11At that time, wait, don't leave quite yet.

3:04:14At that time, Council will discuss the appeal.

3:04:16Staff, the appellants, and the applicant should plan to be present on that date in the event Council has questions for the parties.

3:04:23Uh, can we please, Rebecca, move to item— to open item number 7?

3:04:29Item number 7, amend city code and improve land use regulations through the Regulatory Improvement Code Amendment Package 11, amend Code Titles 32 and 33, document number 2026-189.

3:04:42Colleagues, this item was set as a time certain for today, and I am continuing this item to a time and date certain of July 8th, 2026, at or after 11:00 AM.

3:04:53With that, we— oh, oh, oh, oh, what did I do?

3:04:58Finish the recap item, um, but I just want to make sure we're clear on the record about what's happening to the record of the land use item.

3:05:04Okay, so sorry, item 7 is moved— is continued to July 8th, 2026, at 11:00 AM.

3:05:12Perfect.

3:05:13That's Okay, that's for recap.

3:05:15Yes.

3:05:16And Lauren, what— Can we go back to the land use item?

3:05:23Yes.

3:05:23I don't know if the council clerk needs to call it really quickly just to make sure.

3:05:26Document 2026-217, consider appeals of the Design Commission's approval of a voluntary Central City Master Plan review and adjustment review for the Lloyd Center Central City Master Plan, LU-25-091308CCMSAD.

3:05:39Okay, so the item is continued to a date and time certain of July 8th at— At 10:00 AM.

3:05:45At 10:00 AM.

3:05:46The oral record is closed and the written record is closed for any additional testimony or evidence.

3:05:54The applicant and the appellants are encouraged to return on July 8th should council have additional questions for those parties as well as staff.

3:06:05Thank you.

3:06:06Okay, anything else?

3:06:08Anything else for the good of the order?

3:06:09No.

3:06:09With that, we are adjourned.

3:06:10Thank you, everybody.

3:06:12Oh.